Elebateet anti procettined in Parliament.
1. THE IRISII MUNICIPAL BILL.
In the House of Lords, on Monday, the Marquis of LANSDOWNE asked Lord Lyndhurst, whether he wished him to move the Irish Mu- nicipal Bill, to the merit of which Lord Lyndhurst had the best claim, through its future stages?
Lord LYNDHURST replied, that if Lord Lansdowne, or any other member of the Goverment, chose to move the recommitment of the bill, be should be ready to propose his amendments. Lord LANSDOWNE resumed, and spoke as follows.
"Then, my Lords, as the noble and learned lord seems to think it is my duty so to do, I am undoubtedly prepared to move the recommitment of this bill. I am prepared to move the recommitment of this bill, for the purpose of show- ing the respect I entertain for the deliberations of the other House of Parlia- ment, which sent up this measure for our consideration. It is in this sense alone I beg it may be distinctly understood, that I believe it to be my duty to move the recommitment of the bill : it will be in this sense alone that I shall (should the noble and learned lord not do so) move the bill through the remain. jog stages it has to pass in this House. I repeat, that as the noble and learned lord declines to make the motion, I shall certainly move the bill both in its present and future stages ; but I wish it to be understood, that in so doing, I do not adopt either the principles or the details of the bill—for both principles and details have been changed since it came into this House—and that I only take this step for the purpose of affording to the other House of Parliament an opportunity of considering if it is able to recognize the identity of their bill in that which shall be returned to them." (Cheers.) LOrd LYNDHURST merely wished the ordinary course of proceeding to la adopted,—that a member of the Government should take charge of ameasure introduced by the Government.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE would not oppose the recommit- stent.of the bill; but as be took it to be a positive insult to the People elf Ireland, should give it his strenuous opposition, unless materially shored in the Committee.
Lord !momenta was ready to go on with his amendments ; and thought that the discussion had better be taken on the third reading. Lord Lowsnownx then said— "In order that the noble and learned lord may remove the imperfections which are to be found in the bill as it has been reconstructed, I now wove that du House resolve itself iuto Committee. In doing so, however, I must say, that I entirely concur in the observations wild& Imre fallea from the noble anarcpsissrear ine; and I shall be ready to egeod Ma fey support in the oppo- shim he meditates giving to the bill in its fuemielairo." The souse Avettt into Committee ; the newel clauses were dis- posed et, with some alteraFrons ; and, alter a brief discussion, it wits agreed that the report should be received the next day, and the third reading take place on Wednesday, in order that the bill might be sent down to the Commons before the holydays.
On Tuesday, the Marquis of LANSDOWNE moved that the report be received.
The Duke of WELLINGTON objected to the third reading of the bill being taken on Wednesday ; which was an unusual day for business, and many of their Lordships had formed engagements for that day, which it would be inconvenient to break.
Lord LANSDOWNE said, he had named Wednesday, because Thurs. day would, he was told, be an inconvenient day. He should certainly move the third reading on Wednesday.
Lord LYNDHURST wished that the third reading to be postponed till Friday.
Lord HADDINGTON certainly had not expected that the third reading would be pressed before the holydays.
Lord LANSDOWNE felt very reluctant to postpone the third reading. He considered it desirable that the Members of the House of Commons should have an opportunity of considering the various alterations made in it, during the holydays.
Lord ELLENBOROUGH wished Friday to be the day, in order that the measure might receive additional consideration, and he made as perfect a piece of legislation as possible.
Lord HOLLAND said, that many Peers now absent, but who were in the House on the previous evening, had made their arrangements on the faith of the third reading being on Wednesday, and it would be unfair to them to alter the day. It was finally agreed, that the third reading should be on Wednesday.
On Wednesday, accordingly, the Marquis of LANSDOWNE moved the third reading of the bill, in the following speech.
" My Lords, 1 rise to move the third reading of the altered bill, which now stands entitled An Act for the Regulation of Municipal Affairs in Ireland, and for the Abolition of Municipal Corporations therein.' In rising to move this third reading, it certainly will be necessary for me to occupy but a very short portion of your Lordsh ips' attention ; and I shall be glad if my comparative brevity upon this occasion shall in some degree mitigate the inconvenience to which I ant sensible I may have put some of your Lordships, by requiring as a favour your attendance here on this usually vacant evening. That the subject to which I ant about to direct attention is one of paramount importance I am but too well aware; but, nevertheless, it certainly would be unpardonable in me were I to occupy any considerable portion your Lordships' time, when I feel it impo-sible for me to a.lt you to give a third reading to this bill on any other argument than the one I shall presently have to state. The position in which your Lor :ships stand in connexion with this measure is simply this: The Commons house of Par- liament having sent up to us a bill, the object of which was the substitution for self-elected and irresponsible corporations in Ireland, corporations that should be responsible, and should be fairly elected by the people of that country, it has seemed fit to the majority of your Lordships materially to alter that measure, and carefully to take out of the bill all those portions of it which gave life and existence to new corporations, while you have been pleased to retain all that extinguished life in all existing corporations whatever. The effect, therefore, of the bill as it now stands adopted by your Lordhips, is, that the corporate system is for ever annihilated in Ireland, and thit the title of the bill—for the preliminary words are somewhat unnecessary—should, instead of being' An Act for the Regulation of Municipal Corporations and Borough Towns,' be Ant Act fur Abolishing the Corporations of Ireland, and making the Lind-Lieu- tenant of Ireland for the time being sole corporator thereof.' ("Hear, hear !") Sly Lords, I have sometimes beard persons out of this House, 1,69 learned than your Lordships, who expressed some difficulty in knowing what was the means. Ing of the legal term corporation sole.' My Lords, if this bill shall pass into a law, you will he able to boast of having given to the world an opportunity of witnessing in my noble friend rear me, the present Lord Lieutenantof Ireland, a living specimen of that legal character, exescising, in the vulgar as well as legal sense of a corporation so' :e all the rights, privileges, and immunities of the existing corporate bodies of that country. (Laughter). This, my Lords, it is needless for me to assure you, was far front the view of those whit, introduced this bill in the other House of Parliament : it was far from the view of the ma- jority of that other House of Parliament who adopted this bill on its being so introduced to them. They contemplated no such unheard-of concentration of powers in the hands of any sin& man. (Loud cheers.) They did, undoubt- edly, contemplate that measuie to which your Lordships have Iken pleased to assent—and the ,full value of that assent I undoubtedly feel : they did, cer- tainly, propose to extinguish all that was proved to be corrupt and ini.chievous, and all that was liable to become corrupt and mischievous, in the existing cor- porations of Ireland; but they did not propose by their measure to pass sen- tence upon the character and institutions of that country, and to record its people as unfit and incapable of sust iining any thing like those functions which for centuries have been exercised, fairly exercised, by their fellow subjects in die Corporations, great and small, of England and Scotland." He felt the full value of the sanction which the Peers bad given to the first principle of the bill, by abolishing the Corporations. "I‘ bat was a great object to be attained; but he much regretted that their Lord,hips had refused to cooperate with the House of Cummons ia
the construction of a more wholesome corporate system— •
" In the attainment of that object, your Lordships have refused cooperating ; and I therefore think it is but right and fitting, that the other House of Par- liament should be apprized of the way in which your Lordships have dealt with their measure—(apprized of the masons and motives which guided your Lordships in your decision respecting this measure, I fear neither the other House of Parliament nor the public are ever likely to be; and I am sure it would not be for me to undertake the difficult task of explaining them); and, as the only course by which they can be duly made acquainted with the stated events on this great question of legislation, no noble lord having moved for a conference with the other House of Parliament, will be put to them regularlf in possession of the bill in its amended—I should say in its altered—form, I have come forward for the purpose of requesting your Lortships to pass the bill through its remaining stages. My Lords I desire it may be distinctly under- stood, that it is on these grounds alone I beg of you to give the bill a third reading. I thought it my duty the other evening to tender to those who mad* this bill their own, the opportunity of puttiug it through its latter stages; but, as your Lordship. are aware, that offer, those to whom I allude thought propel to decline. (" Hear, hear I " from the Opposition benches.) 1 make rocs my Lords, of the wads 411unit this bill their own,' because, according • memorandum which I have now before me, I find that the state of the bill, as it pasaed the other House, is entirely differeut from what it is at present. The preamble has been amended ,• sixty.six of the clauses have been altered so as searcely to be recognized ; of new claims twenty-seven have been added ; and of the clauses sent up by the other House of Parliament only eight Lave been pre- served. I think therefore I am justified in stating, that the noble and learned lord, and those who acted with him, have made this bill their own; and further, that I was juatified in proposing to the noble and learned lord to conduct to its termination the bill which he had so made his own. ( Loud cheers.) But, when the noble and learned lord declined the task, I undoubtedly felt it to be my duty offer to your Lordships to conduct this bill to the final stage, by which would be insured its regular transmission to the other House of Patliament. If on this occasion I could have hoped to alter your. Lordshit s' determina- tion, I should undoubtedly have thought it my duty once more to ask your Lordships, as a question of policy and as a question of wisdom, to COOBider whether it became this House—the depository of many of the most valuable privileges that are maintained by law in this country, and the guardian by pro- fession of many other privileges, which, though not attached to it, are protected and supported by its existence—I say, my Lords, I should have ventured tosug- gest the policy of reconsidering whether it is wise and prudent in that House which is the hrst privileged body in the country, to make itself the instrument of stripping all the corporate bodies in Ireland of their privileges, and to use the prerogative vested in It by the laws in infringing the liberties and rights of the people. (Loud cheers.) This course I certainly should have ventured once more to suggest to your Lordships' consideration, if I eould have hoped to shake the determination you have come-to; but, entertaining the feeling that such a hope is now altogether futile, it is not my intention tonight to give your Lordships the trouble of a debate, for the purpose of restoring the bill to its former state. I shall, for the reasons I have given, now move that the bill be read a third time ; but 1 do so with a decided protest against the supposition that such a motion involves, on my part, any approval of its contents, or at least of diet portion of itti contents which effects the perpetual destruction of all corporate bodies in what once was the sister kingdom of Ireland. Having snails that protest in a manner which I think will be understood in this House and in the country, I can have no hesitation, on the grounds I have stated, and on those grounds alone, in asking your Lordships at once to give to this bill a third reading." (Loud cheers.)
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE observed, that the bill had a direct tendency to a separation, by forcible means, of Ireland from England. The measure was insulting to the Irish nation. But he would not oppose the third reading, for the reasons stated by Lord Lansdowne.
The Earl of HADDINGTON denied that there was any intention on his side of the House to insult the people of Ireland. Their object had been to abolish the Corporations, which were not fit to be main- tained, and to prevent the erection of a worse system on their ruins. By passing this bill, the House was not precluded from giving municipal institutions to Ireland at a future time, if they should be deemed advan- tageous to that country. After a few words from Lord GORT, relative to some observations made in reference to himself in the House of Commons.
Lord ALVANT.EY commented at some length on the general policy of Ministers in regard to Ireland, which he disapproved of ; and expressed his determination to support Lord Lyndhurst's bill.
The bill having then been read a third time, 'File Duke of RICIIMOND rose and moved the insertion of a clause, which would have the effect of giving municipal institutions to the seven largest towns in Ireland. He deprecated the system of legis- lating against an individual, and advised their Lordships to strengthen their position by adopting a wise and conciliatory policy.
Lord LYNDHURST opposed the motion; on the ground that it would occasion extensive changes in the bill—
It would be necessary to reinsert thirty or forty clauses which hail been ex- cluded, as well as to alter and amend every one of them. Now, unless their Lordships were prep/red to do that, the bill would he inconsistent on the very face of it ; and there woi no mode, consistently with retaining these clauses, by which the object of the noble duke could be carried into effect. Therefore he suggested to hint the difficulty-, in point of form, with which the noble duke had to contend.
The Duke of RICHMOND said, that as the objection was one of form, not of principle, he should be willing to devote the necessary time to remodel the bill; and would even sit on Thursday with that view. (Laughter.) The Marquis of CLANItIcARDE said, this was an illustration of the mode of legislating on Irish affairs. Was it to be urged as an objection againq a motion of such importance, that it would occasion the delay of a day or so?
Lord LYNDHURST though it right to intimate to the Duke of Rich- mond, the objection in point of form to his motion ; hut did not deem it necessary to discuss over again a question which had been already diseusssed in the Committee.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE condemned this mode of arguing against the motion, and termed it "quibbling."
Lord ELLENBOROUGH suggested, that the Marquis of Clanricarde ought to have been prepared himself with the necessary clauses, if he deemed the motion of such importance.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE earnestly supported the motion ; and insisted upon the great advantage of preserving the corporate principle . in Ireland-- "My Lords, (he said) I do then most sincerely express my hope—though feeble hope I confess it is—that even at this hour you will adopt the motion
tinny liable friend on the cross benches. The noble and learned lord has ataosi that thia amendment interfered with the object which I ventured to state Itai iu view—namely, that the bill should go dawn to the House of Commons, witk the exhibition of all the alterations which have been made in it, on as early a day as possible. That hope 1 expressed through a fear that you would not reeon,ider your former determination, or adopt any amendment so impor-
tant as that which the noble if has proposed. But so far front regretting any delay that should take place were the noble duke's amendment carried, though that course would involve a delay of some one or two days, I should think-every hour, every day, and week well eniployed, which was necessary for eanying the spirit of that amendment through all the provisions of the bill ; be- cause I should feel persuaded that it was time devoted to the public service and and employed in reconciling the House of Commons to the adoption of the'alte- rtions which your Lordships may make, and raising the character and repute- tma of this House,—because, if you assent to my views you will show an anxiety, which would do honour to you, to maintain in Ireland thOse ancient institutions framed and Wired neon that principle which in England you have declared to be essential to their existence.' In reference to Lord Alvatiley's observations, be said he should be rendy to defend the conduct of Ministers in relation to Irish affairs, measure by measure. The House then divided—
For the motion—Present, 45
Proxies, 37 — &.2 Against the motion—Present, 80
Proxies, 61 — 141
Majority against the motion, 69.
The Duke of RICHMOND proposed a clause to prevent Recorders from sitting in Parliament.
Lord LYNDHURST opposed the motion. The question, if touched at all, should be made the subject of a distinct bill. The motion was negatived; and
The bill was then passed.
It was sent to the House of Commons on Thursday, with a message from the Peers, requesting the consent of the Commons to their Lord- ships' amendments ! After some conversation on private bills had been concluded, Mr. O'BRIEN asked Lord John Russell, how he intended to proceed with respect to the Municipal Bill ? For himself, as an Irishman, he would say, that he considered the alterations the bill had undergone a direct insult to his country ; and, if no other Member better qualified to bring the subject before the House would do so, he should feel it his imperative duty to move that it be read that day six months.
Lord JOHN RESsELL said, in reply to the question of Mr. O'Brien, that when the proper time for commencing public business arrived, he Fhould move that the amendments of the other House of Parlia- ment be read a first time, and printed. Lord John then proceeded as follows- 4' When those amendments have been printed and are in the hands of honour- able Members, their effect and bearing upon the principle of the measure will he folly and clearly under•tood. I am quite stile that the House will agree with ow, thet the course which I 'nave ventured to point nut is that most be- coming the Nleifila:ra of this House, and best calculated to express the calm and &libel ate st nse of this branch of the Legislature. In the letters of a dis- tinguished foreigner, recently published, speaking in reference to the events of the last yeat, and to the differences which occurred between the two Houses of Parliament, die writer reniarks, as a matter of curious observation, that the assembly which waa most popular in its constitution evinced the greatest de-. gree of calmness and temper, whilst that branch of the Leehlature which was of an hereditary clairieter, betrayed has temperance of conduct in its proceed- ings. It is my wish, Sir, that if hereafter fiifirrences should unfortunately arise between this arid the other House of Pal liament in respect to public Irma- suree, the same ettanteter should still attach to the proceedings of this House. and toot me may continue to deserve that praise which the writer to whom 1 base alluded has bestowed on us, not only from foreigners, but from our own cotton ymen With respect to these amendments, I have not yet been able to read them Oil : I atti not sufficiently aware of their nature to say how far they do or do not preserve the pi inciole embodied in the hill as it was for- warded front this House, or how far they are calculated to defeat the objects contempland be that bill. It would, hum-even, be affectation. in me to say that I ant not todfieiently acquainted with the import of those alterations, to know that the bill has been totally altered in its natore., and that it is no longer what by its title it professed to lie when hiving this House, A Bill for the Regulathm of aluincipal Corporations and Towns in Leland.' From whet I can understaed of the name and (+armlet of these amendments, the bill, as now return, d to us, naly [limpet ly he designated an Act for the destruction, the annihilation, the total aboLtion of existing Slunicipal Corporations in Ire- land."
Having thus stated his opinion of the nattire of the amendments, he would add. that so far from seeking a collision a ith the other House, he should be ready to discuss the nIterations temperately, and to make every Concession which was consistent with the dignity of the House of Committee— "II it woe stated Hutt the municipal franchise was not in every instance confided to preei.ely that class wit cite e i I oat advar,tagtom-1;, —if it were said that :be powel:, vested in the ddierent munic;p d governntents welt too circumseribeil in son•e cases, and too extended in others,— I weld(' have been ready to diseliss these objections. On all such points I should have un objec- aiuml nudge compromise. But 1 trust the House will tion to C to a fair do me the justice, to sinipoe that I must remain free from the imputation of being a pal ticioaior ii depriving the people of Ireland altegether of municipal government, awl thereby ilffit aim; on them a mat k if di-titetion, which can- not but he conaidered as a stigma and degradation. (Loud cheers.) It is our desire as well as interest, to unite the people of the st.ner kiogilom in one com- mon I of affectioti with the people of England. If six out of eight million* of the inhabitants of that country, differing in language, differing in religion, were old) anximei for an opportunity to shake off a governinelit which they consideled .al :Hid oppressive, then perhaps I might be prepared to de- prive the people of Ireland altogether of free institutions, and to look to the sword alone as the means of maintaining our empire. But having no such belief, tottertai. ing mu such opinion, but whiling that the people of Ireland should be tit tidy milted to this country, and convinced that if they are treated— I will not 'ay with im!ulgence, I will not say with kindness. I will not nay with generosity, but I will say with justice—( Mach eheerlay)—with that justice with which Englishmen ahoutil be prepared, and. I believe, ale prepared to heat tie it sobjeet.—in that apish!, in the stoke ofahe 'lowest:Ion made in 1793, in the spirit ,it the coi ces: 013 called Gal colic Emancipation, and in the spirit with which. sinee that date, the penal laws have been relaxed,-1 shall be ready to argue, that unless you choose to go back and to chatigd the yhoeurmliicy altogether (whatever may be our views with respect to s , and the parricidal bearing of certain of the provisions of the bill), this House it ill not consent to dewier Ireland altogether of the hope of menisipal If it should do so, this House would government. ( Cheers pan all sides). not only I e striking a Mow at the Union with Ireland, it weld& not merely be acting partially Ullfi unjustly on an Irish torstion. but it would be inffictitig • wound on the spirit of Ise gevel nment itself. ( Cheri s. ) We should be de- claring that that di-cu'siois that that debate. that that divhim of opinionWIlich
are the consequences mmmiii c minitants of all free government, were tin lager
. he n14010%141 or even tolerated. (Cheers.)
in the English House of C
Having thus, without going into an argument U pun the especial prtwisioiss of these amendments, stand my view of any pion. or of any change in the bill which would go to the length of abolishing or destining munieipal government altogether in Leland. I shall merely conclude by moving that the Lords' Amea•lownte be printed. and taken into cousideratitio on a future aay, which I shall presently name." (Cheers. ) Sir GRORRE SINCLAIR said, thnt the Protestants of this country, but especially those of In hot& had great cause to be thankful that the measures passed by t be Mouse of Commons teem patiently sifted and patiently examined before another tribunal-
" Them is no public aasenibly at thitt moment in the empire which enjoya a brae, share of the coefidence. respeet, and gratitude of the religioua,
and intelligent classes of the community, than the llonve of Lords. ( Cheri s end lawghter.) That body i. looked upon as the main bulwark of the National Church. and the chief hart ier against revolutionary encroachments. The noble bed tells us that he wishes these amendment,' to be considered cautit usly and dispassionately. I do not know whether he has seem in the Alm rainy Chi onicle of tins day. at letter flout an honourable geotlematt lately n leinber of this House ; but I beg leave to read an ti del HI two boot it. ( epic.% " Read a att ") I apprehetal that I am at liberty to Ilse my own gliseretion ; and I sltall only trouble the flimsy with that part which indicates the feelings of the influen- tial person by Omni the letter is arnbessell to the Peaple of England. Ile says—' I wish to know whether the British people are wady to submit in quiet sad without remonsttance to the it responsible, and therefore despotie, authcoity of that assembly, 8.r will they now join with me to make the Union real, by Heisting. in a valee too distinct to he tnivuoderstatal, it too loud to be neglected, upon an orgt • a kluge in that assembly , such as has become alavo- %gay neresso y for the consolidation of a real union hem. 11 both cotintt tea, and for the advanttement of good government in vault.' Upon this point I agree with Mi. O'Connell. I OW ((II c00% inert!, that it hat he is pleased to call jos- ties to Ireland can never he aretimplished without an organic change ha the House of Lords. There is not a siogle man there who will stitta himstof to be controlled or intimidated by Ilk Majesty's Alinistet v, and it is luckily not an tursembly which they have it in their pots t I o dissolve." ( Cheers.) Mr. O'Conla II had told his vonstititents, that he seas a support( r of the ptesent Government : now Ite to know st.ltether .11 imisters
concurred in the sentiments he halal just read from 'Mr. 0 Connell's letter—whether they were prepared to make an organic change in that assetn lily ?
" There are Mend) rst now within hearing, who last session said a good thNtl about at leferm of the Ilonse of Lords. They then gave certato pledges which
they have 'level skive etaleemed 7 t he 01 air- II:, iv now u; he table, pen mid ink are a ithin their reach, and I shall he most happy to see any honourable gentleman enter a 11111 I(41 upon the subject. ( )i t 4/. I . Lours they have constantly talked of it—f • morttiog till night, and from night till morning ; hut here
the question l4 passed over in most (IIhItIIIIIM silence. The ()rater hook iv nearer to his alajesty'a Attorney. General than to any other lember, and I should
be glad to i•ec a motion emanate fr the right honourable gentleman for making an mganic change it. the House of Lhhilla. ( Cheers ondloughter.) In one tespeet, it must be coofessed that Ministers have shown wonderful dex• terity—they have COI trivetl to muzzle and manacle the Radicals ire now never hear one wood of their peculiar opinion-, inor of their peettliar motions. I see an honourable gentleman opposite ( Ale. Hume) who seems to have been struck with a political pat alpha ; his mouth has been drawn entirely to one aide—( Cheers)—and his tongue has It:fused to distil:trait its duty COW plain. ing of superfluous patronage, and denouncing Ministo i."11 profusion. ( ter. ) This state at things reminds me of what I 011ee heard if certain Indian jugglers in this town. Those di-tinguished conjure' a would take a hole basket full of boa constrictors, and allow thern to twist and tie jut- about their arms, kg., and even their necks; hut if any bystander attempted to tatieli them, he Was stung to the quirk for his temerity. Now Al in istet s, although no conjurors, have managed to tame the Radietals, and to make them twist and twine about their necks; their embraces were pike paternal, but nobody elso could enjoy the tame privikge. If other Ministos had brow hat in the very same measut es, the House would never have heard the last tit the opposition of the Radicals; there would have been debate upon th bate, and div isnot intim division : but when they were introduced bv the present 31tnisters the Radicals remained petfectly quiesceot, and the left wing of the Ministelial phalanx is as obedient as thr light. Accoolingly, they produced two measures in patticular—the lush Municipal Reform Hill and the Irish Church Bill Neither ran heroine the law of the land as long as the House of Lords remains as it is. There is the peat safeguard of the Constitution—( Cheeps and lanyhter)—and never, without what Mr. O'Conttell calls an organic change,' can we be deprived of that safeguard. For that teason I shall resist such a clamps to the last : for I consider the House of Linda the only barrier against the complete establialtment of Popery in Ireland."
They all recollected how Brennus dealt with the patricians of Rome, and perhaps the modern Brennen: might in the stone mariner hope to outweigh the House of Lords; but Sir Geolge would tell Lord John Russell, that he never would be able to overcome the undaunted courege of that assemble, toeless Ile merehed into it with 150 Peers, in liveries of blue at d bud, at his heels- " Unless he alters the constitution of that assembly— unless he persuades his Maje-ty to create 150 new Peers—he may rest assured that he will never he able to carry throngh Parliament the clause for spoliating the Irish Church, or the other provision for establishing normal schools of agitation in every quar- ter of Ireland. I repeat, that the best thanks of the country are due to the House of Lords. I repeat. that they possess and enjoy in a greater clever than
any other tribunal the tetarct and coofidence of the ( Cheers Pon& Me Opposition side, and laughter from Me Ministerial side of the House.) It includes in its numbers the st learned of out cleigy, the must profound of our lawyers, the most distinguished of our het oes, and the most honest anti
influential of • citizens. Mildly 11 bill is sent up hoot this House which does Rot bear most unequivocal and humiliating marks of crude and partial legisla- tion; it is the business, the praetive. anal the plovince of the House of Lords to detect our anotnalies top supply out defiriencies, and to rectify our blunders. There is not a measureI t
tad_ MOWS bark from thence unimproved ; and their
Lordships at all tittles show their superiority in talents, in la •ledge, in temper, and in statesmanlike qualities. Although tie have provided commodious
benches here for the accommodation of their Lordships, we never have the riemdire a seeing any of them; hut if a dimenssion takes ;dare in the other Mouse, bliitistel s and Radieals are obset ved crowding 01 the bar, and eagerly listening, although I. their great prnsonal inconvenience. If nitexpeetediy astintnotted from thence to vote in a division, although tiny may not have heard a single word of the debate, how whoa Italy do flit y have their stations, and tattoo to them aftel welds with the gteediest expeditem !"
Sir George concluded by declaring, that the House of Lords had earned a debt of gratitude which public approbation would pay ; and that the Members of the flutist' of Commons who joined ha amendieg the bill, would be h wird down to poste' ity among the eminent bene- factors of their country!
Lord Joust Russem. observed, that whatever reasoning the speech
el Sir George Sinclair 7.oiatHielerl, must nut he taken as an answer to his speech ; for be hod not discussed the metits or demerits of the House of Lords; and he hoped the House would not be led away from the real question before it. Mr. HOME supposed that he was alluded to by Sir George Sinclair as having attended the debates in the House of Lords. He had done so, and had listened with the utmost astonishment to the language used in that assembly. From the tone of authority in which Sir George Sin- clair spoke, he was led to believe that the House of Lords never would do justice to Ireland.
Sir GEORGE SINCLATR—" I did not say so."
Mr. Hume continued. The declarations of Sir George Sinclair amounted to that : be said that the House of Peers never would concede what the majority of the House of Commons thought was justice to Ireland-
,' While lie was stating the differences between this and the other House, I wish he bad shown tut also some way of getting out of the difficulty in which
we are now placed. Ile says that Ministers never can overc lllll e the majority of the Peers; but let me ask hint, how are the Peers to overcome the bilge ma- jority of the People? (Much cheering.) He expresses surprise that I and
other Radicals should go on so smoothly and quietly with the present Govern-
ment. No doubt he heat lily wishes it was otherwise. Ile asserts, that it' the mine measures had been ploposed by other Ministers, we should factiously oppose them. To this I have to answer, that no such measures have beeu brought forward by the other side, then-fore he has no means of„makieg the comparison. When did he ever hear of any sincere 'Mention on that stile of the House to respect the rights of the people ? When did he ever hear on that side such sentitnents as have just been delivered by the noble lord ? When my honourable ft lend rose, I lose also, in order to expos what I trust is the opi- nion of the honourable friends who surrtnind me. The noble lord stated &oily and decidedly what was his wish and the wish of the Government respecting the measure as sent from the House of Lortls. Ile deplored the changes with- out entering into particulars regattling them ; but with the means of intOrma- tion we possess, we cannot be ignorant of what has been done; and I beg my honourable friend to recollect, that one of the great evils and curses of the country has been the treatment of Ireland—the unecontl, tyrannical, and oppressive treatment of her for centuries. ( Cheers.) If he asks, then, what is the bond of union between the Radicals and the Whigs, I answer, that it
is the principle mow laid down for the first titne, of doing equal juttice
to Ireland. I believe that that is the chief, the sole bond which has united, and I hope will continue to unite us. Differences of opinion may,
must exist: all shades ase bete—I trust all shades of reform ; hut let me inquire how did the House treat Mr. O'Connell's motion for Repeal? I. a ttttt ng
others, strongly reprobated it. I wished indeed to improve the condition of the people of behind ; but I most strenuously opposed the motion, and agreed to the amendment—fcr wheat was it? That this House would proceed to do ample justice to Ireland in all matters of legislation or arrangement. There was, I think, only one English Member who supported the Repeal ; and he did all because he was impressed, like my honourable friend opposite, that the !Muse
of Lords never would do justice to heland ; in order that Ireland might have justice, he voted for the Repeal of the Union. As to the debt of gratitude to the House of Lords, I have no hesitation in saving, that if there be any body of men in the kingdom whose acts have been more detrimental to peace and tran- quillity than another, it is the House of Lords." (Much cheering.) It was said that the Protestants bad cause for rejoiuing in the eon. duct of the Lords : but if so, had not the Catholics cause for mourn- ing? If one-tenth of the population were pleased, and nine•teliths dissatisfied, what must be the result ? He hoped that the House of Commons would persevere in its determination to obtain justice for Ireland. Let the collision come when it might, that House had nut sought it. He would tell Sir George Sinclair why he had not brought forward his motion for Peerage Reform- " I found that at different public meetings sonic of the Peers had declared that no doubt justice would he done to Ireland by the House of lands. I waited therefore to see the issue; and if I had not waited patiently, how I should have been met I need not say. I do not now anticipate what preceedings may he necessary, but I have no hesitation in saying that last session the country looked for some motion for the reform of the House of Lotds. This year we wished to leave them to act without any thing like an impending threat. As an individual Member, I declare it to be my decided opinion, that the conduct of the other House has been highly detrimental ; that it is the only stop at the piesent moment to that happiness anti prosperity which the country was likely other- wise to enjoy. (cheers.) I regret exceedingly to hear that the House of Lords notouly stands, hut internist° stand, in the way of national improvement— that it is opposed to all alterations—to all reforms. Cisme to some COL ehisien it must and will. As to an organic change, let me inquire for what was the House of Lords established ? for what was the House of Commons established ? To give good government to the people. ( Cheers.) If it he found tht any branch of the Legislature—the house of Lords, for instanee—o•pposes obstinacy to reason and justice, and actually refuses measures deemed essenti al by the Refire- sentatives of the People, the question then arises, what are we to do ? Every man will ask whether we are to allow 140 or 150 individuals to impede the progress of good government? Are we to plaice ourselves at the met ey clothe Lords, and to leave them to dole out what they think good, just in the quatitthes that they think ploper ? My honourable hien(' knows that if we employ ma- chinery, and the cogs oi one of tile wheels do not act, that the wheel noist be repaired or removed. Do not let him fancy that there is any thing scat ell in the character of the House of Lords, which can enable it to impede good govern- ment with impunity; and he is mistaken if he thinks the people of England will bear it."
Twenty-five years ago, Sir George Sinclair had delivered a maiden speech in favour of Reform : his opinions had sitiee undergone all or- ganic change ; but, as an early Reformer, he would ask him what must follow, if the other House obstructed the measures necessary for the peace and happiness (tithe country? It was tionsense to say that the House of Commons, which had restricted the power of the Crown and reformed itself, could not also reform the House of ',mils. I hat House had entered into a sacred engagement to do justice to Ireland; but, by mangling the Corporation Bill, had deviated that the people. of Ireland should not have equal justice. He therefore protested against their whole conduct.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM admitted that the present crisis of affairs was somewhat dangerous ; and he highly approved of the temperate and staid a- tnatilike advice given by Lord John Russell, at the cominvocement of his speech, to proceed with calmness and deliberation. He regretted that Lord John had not maintained the same tone to the conclusion of his speech, but had been led away to comment upon the amendments, of whose nature he admitted the House was not yet inforuled. He certainly held out a strong inducement to the House to reject those_ amendments, and be led irresistibly to the conclusion that the people of
Ireland could not take them-
" If (continued Sir James) I thought that concession after concession wonh
'd
naturally produce contentment, I might be led to take that course, even at I is risk ofdanger. Mv noble friend I as meta.' ned &rifts ceneess:ons: one in i.e.') no. at a a it, mt. lu. t tor the t • u . 0 o lutes.' I.
1793, which granted the elective frauchete, mid when si the Te.t sEd Cori o ration Act may be said to have been virtually erpealed iii 1111 ntl although it did not sti Italy lead to that result. Next he 'vie' red to the concession of 1829, which placed Homan Catholics on 4 footing of perfect equality. His inferenee was, that because these great conceseione had been nude, and made in vain, therefote we ought to proceed further. I doula the policy of such advice. I
may that where great national comes.' have been made, and those who nude them have been disappointed in their expectations, instead of being hurried on from concession to • vssion in a downwind path, without being called upon to halt, the time has arrived when we ought to pause. I contend that jcu must deliberate before you proceed further in the same direction. ( Cheers.) And here I am reminded of the observation of u loan of as great experient•e ill government as any living : I allude to Prince Talleytand. What be is reported to have said is full of truth and wielom—' Those who commence a gtiverti- went of concession, never fail in the end to make son e concession they did 'tot contemplate when thtty began their cal vet, which concession pi IIITM
fatal te them.' I hope my noble niend will not expel ience this result in its full extent."
He %void(' next advert to what fell from Mr. Hume, about over- coming the difficulties of the position in a hich the I.egislat ure found itself. He did not think that it was the duty of any individual, but of the Government, to propose the intents of solving these difficulties; and he fancied that lord John Russell hinted at some mode of re- conciliation, m hen he observed that his objection to the amendments was, that they entirely removed in government from Ireland. I-lis own objection, he confessed, was to the constructive part of the bill ; he approved of the destruction of the exclusive emporatioes. Ile was the unffinehing friend of reform, but not of revolution- " Having been bout tooter a litnited archy, with a Home of fords co- ordinate in authot itv with the 'Lowe. of COM lllllll s—a II. useof Lords hetedi • tary, not elected by the People—I, for one, can never consent to that which, under the the ha toe Ill refot in, is molting more nor lesa than rectilution. To such a reform, I trust, I shall always he Mood opposed. The Member foe Middlesex talks contemptuously of the number of those by n hoot the lull on the tattle has been altered from the shape itt riling' it was sent op by this House. 'flue House of Lords was; not so notneroua a body as the House of Commons; but tlue amendment which woe made in this hill by the House of Lords %vete made by a maim ity of two to one of a body which the Constitution declare. to be co-ottUnate in legislative power with ourselves. It is possible that a tittle may arrive when ii e general opitiion shall declare that the House of buds ought no longer to exist, and when what I have already charttetei ized as a 'evolution with reference to that body b11:111 take place. But, Sit, the public men of this cottony are at present on their trial. I firmly believe that the people a e still warmly attached to the existing form of our Govertunent. Whrther proceeding I aty politic man, from any :Minister, flout the House of Commie's, or hoot the House al Lords, I ant convinced that at ,y u a It or im- prudent step—that any . viols tit •uwasure, threat.iting in its consequences to
involve the peace and tranquillity of the empire— ttot be pardoned by a
people, too it attached tO tht. exi-ting institution. of the country, too much attached to the preset t• ition of lilies ty, too much attached to the seem it)' ut proper ty, to tisk any of those benefits for a speculative theoretical proposition, recommended on the grotandsof a remote and continger.t advantage."
Sir .Ti roes concluded by expressing his regret t hat the observittiOnS of Lord John Russell should have provoked this discussion ; and de (daring that lie xvoluld not etto;itott to depart Ii ow the votes he hail
already given on the Irish I 'it; munition Hill; that so far from thinking compromise desirable, he would st: o .gly prote-t agaitist it.
Lord Cu:mesas said. it ;nide the blood boil in his Irish veins to hear the dispusition to do Ireland justire called " concession." But he would cheek himself, and endeavour to be Calm- " Are the inunieipii t•orporations of England to he refut ii iii for the good of the people of England, and is the Fenn to of the municipal corporations of Ire- land for the gond of the people of Ireland to be called a t•oneession ? 1 repeat, that it is impossible for me to listen to stieh language withotat protesting in the etiongt.st manner against the doctrine which it involves. Sir, I touch fear that the Plotestatits of Ireland have notch more to fear Irma their zealous hut inju- dicious ft Laois, duo it have fr heir worst cue lll i llll For myself, I hope atal
believe that I ain eme•cient. sly avail's d to the relig. which I profess; but I deeply regret that the inlet eras ii tlut religion have In•eit takca up its the manner in which they It see been taken up, tied that the Tories seem desirous of maintaiiiilig the distioctiton between Catholics and Protestants in Ireland, in- stead of trying to forget all religious differences, and to merge them in one general fi•eling for the common good. Sir, I am convinced tint if this destruc- tive meastoe sent to us by the lI,uuie of Lords, be adopted by the House of Com- mons, many a Protestant in behind will lose his rights. And why is this done? To me it is evident, that, merely for the sa'te of destroying the rights of the Catholica in It elau.1 the House of Lords have consconal to destroy the tights of the Protestants in that couotrv. We have been told of lb i•ish dominion Over behold : to such language I can never listen without tes.ottnietit. Con- cession and &mind llll Was it cuncession to Ireland when the penal laws against the e'atholies in that country were abrogated ? Was not that abroga- tion calculated to be at least as beneficial to the Plotest nits 1 flueland as to the Catholics? I will always stand up for the country from which I come ; and
will never bear the terms concession or domi applied with reference to that tummy without the frank expression of my freliegs. The House of
Lords, by the course which they have adopted on this n, have prevented much good from being done. I do front the bottom of my heart believe that the majority of the House of Lotds have taken the comae which they have taken on the present question' because they dared to do with reference to the people of Ireland, what they did not dare to do with reference to the people of England."
He owed an apology to the House for his warmth ; but he was con- vinced—and Ile was sure that the great majority of the People of England coincided with him—that if the Lords were allowed to have their way in this matter, it was all over with popular rights in Ireland. Mr. EVELYN DENISON observed, that Sir James Graham's admo- nition to Members on the Ministerial side of the House on the danger of the path on which he apprehended they were about to enter, would have been more properly addressed to those who, having commenced great political changes, arid laid down great political principles, did not follow up those changes und principles to their proper termination. When the proper time arrived, he should be ready to state his senti- Silents on the bill before them ; and, approving of the course adopted by Lord John Russell, he should merely add, that a party measure, mini- Elating all municipal govertt:nent in Ireland, was a proceeding in which it was impossible tied the House of Commons could concur.
Mr. SHAW denied that the word "dominion " was used on his side Of the House, in the sense Lord Clements applied to it; and us to "concession," it was constantly used on both sides of the House. He risk ofdanger. Mv noble friend I as meta.' ned &rifts ceneess:ons: one in i.e.') no. at a a it, mt. lu. t tor the t • u . 0 o lutes.' I. What tiro. iltstror tit ins bail he revel% u 1:: It a ti'. a ffillitey to contend that the bill as Srltt fr tl e III/ItSr ii I C.00111.1111S it meld not have com- pletely destroyed tie Itish rignatinos. I be Plime Alinister bad i Ii it her plare at k i uuo 1 edgt I t het i t ...field. A a to legislating for Ireland on the same ptinetph•s as for DeJaittl, it tees quite absurd, on sit.emitit of the ifrel eta eircion-tances of the too countries. Nobody tlesi..ed real told iii 111.11iiii ImitiVu 1111,11. 14411 I r did ; but then, let the term " justice " lit et litit•t1 It owlet stood. The legitimate question before them was, ft.tv arc the tuts iii it Irt lard te be well told peaceably governs d ? Now be was s. tislit 1, ihu.il ii {I iipave to ihe lush towns corporation% constituted tiocardiz g to the hull os it WilS it nt tip to the )uti gave tlo iiig yams of stiong nod viol( rut political t xeitement-
" I cannot help ti it Lieg. that their was sotoethiog iii the • and manure of
the mild, had that it'd eitted something Is %..1.11 thy met... 1110f that amend. ht', 1st,: • Isv the Ili me of lairds in this bill be minted for Moire t•onsidera-
tion. I eau Ititolls lilt thittking, that the Hon', loot had in his cuittemplation it letter it hid. ;ippean d this mot lting, and n hielt bas alseasly been alluded to this evening. iti %% hid, the miter declares that an organi.• change is nerve- s try in the ctaistitutit ta of the Ilion', of Lord., Is, coo..., n idiom such an °r-
eam,. change, there tt net er he an holt 'tendon h',ut homent iii itelatid--without such an nig .1t:c chat ge we shall to 5.,u I :lit, ttuitt.ttut•al t-tditagt• withwat such an ereatu chaliges e shall tie, It lilt t• v..Te by bal'ot. TinsI can tell the noble Ii 1,I, that if SBA :11111 ill orts Ils t11 Out tipou them. Ise will be ii.let s !es the tx-ent of whirls he pet haps does not now anticiiktte. hut iiltich will play, Itito to ui sittiatiou that he ti ill aim fitid tery :tot ceable. There is o• out) to absttril ty hiell has too hi en unoposet. under hieh sounding 10111::41 aolog ills! I.1 11.1•111.11.' Sit, I :1111 itS anximo. as ally wan that Jost tee should be Mow to Ireland ; anti it ic thetefore, that I ran never give my istment to it myosin... n Ii iits 11.y opinion wtsuld be likely to be a ft uitful source f crewolti alal t•ontertion iii Ireland."
Mr. SPRING 1{10E said, lie would answer not merely the arguments, Ion the insiiimei ins of 'Air. Shiite-
" A 11:111.1111111111aidy. a nosy di.ingettimus, a mom unjustifi ible attack. I never liii; ii nun'e Lyon a publiy loan, than that whit.li the right honourable and gehtl..11,11u liv hyolivatiott at Is•ast, made tti my noble friend. Nothine can be no it neje-ofi ible ohm, ti e ItO ar the right honour- able tool learnt II g. TO, Watt iuu..Ido1ut,..1 ui i-ut thing ottalytts. and then suggest- ing that the% are the tootit es f lay no' le ft ie, tl and of sq'ti GOVVID- went. But studs i. the emirs,. is loch the r gilt honourable Jaw] learned gentle- mall and his ft ictols i. v iiiuig ititifinutly pilistied. In order to avoid discussing the real merits of the question. the tight Insulin able and learned gerttlernart ends:mooed to C00111, t the expit.,iffil. In a I. tore written ht. an honourable ;too le.irned gentleman—St he, if he were present, would no doubt have been able to anstter bit himself— is all the opittions which he supposes are entertained by my it I:4111 101r 1.1111011olas havo I'm some time Ikea in the liahit pursniantglIY; 7tynsdtetinhe
!aside fro lid. t Is is totly a part of that miserall'e. that
sdojaion of n Itich soil% s11111%,1 the tteakness t.f tlu,ee a ho e leseend to have
rt.t.ot re tit it. Ti •e troastion is, whether we shall tight or wrong in adopt-
ing Or t•tieg the amend'sur ids which have I1 'en to .41e .lay the House of Lords
its the It ish 3Itt •ieipal Col poraMstis lhilh ? That questtitti might to be treated
at g !eta mole, Iv. all i Llot stw,gy•til.ri or to auy party. What had the t-ight 1ml:storable awl tiCem in to hold toy ruuiIiIe f.nrietode fm tlull pin:otis xis' e•sysl In a 'Hubei, that all or: tilie chat the
II as•e. f was ii.slispensalte Ill shzoireog lilt iinlependent Parlia tent in
Irelaulth to tad i,j r• oat “Ipt.•11.loo vote by luuhIuIt ? Does not C I ight Itosnati;.Le and kat getst'vm..a 'know that sttelt opinions are not rarticirat,d lu hy my noble b ? " Silaw—" I did not say they were."
lir. It No, but flit rie lit lionotiroble gentleman implied it
quotirg ilitt-t• cpittic Its havitig been t xpressed by one who acted in
suppoi I of his liovk "I lie questioa before the speaking Ilium that tittest;titt, if his nohle Ii iend haul not stated what his f..clitus tat u' %volt ty-pt yr tut it, he wools! Is i ye been deficient in candour, int I', uliuliuti ■CInsi., an C011-istrilt'y. But what had that ttt do with the letter whicli appeared this morning. It is It tie that in But letter the extinction of lettnicipat yet letratioas iii Irelantl is leplobatell. Ilut js that a new docttine? Is it 111/t a ditt-tr. tie IA I ich a bug.. itodarity of this Ileum, has sanctitsned by its 1, ore on nine' iota Ma uul I be nob e lord t :11e11.11, r for lutivash ire ? At the time that the propnsitiou to extinguish this., our potations was brought bef'ore us, did e tatt thstincVy th elite that use would not constont to their extinction? That reft:•al ale, I lu. pt., imitated tut tepeat. Is that an unexpected decla- ration? In or I tit of this Ilnisse, in any place wit:net-et, mulch a rct tit must have been supposed. Even Ilia todtle laid himself it ho lu anst.41 the amend- muss could riot 11.1ve imagined that we should concur in them. But it has bes it said that this is a pit mantic diseitssien. T.. a ui liii extent that is the ea-e ; hut it mt.st he recollected, that with iefet cove to this bill as returned to its by the Ilitu-e of Lords, we ate mot in the et minion in which we ate placed with rtfuenee to tall. getuel ui by. In lull is getterally. there may be a discussion on the Mu leading, a disco-sisal mu t Fess cond read., g, a discussion itt the cum- i tree, a II:sett...ion 011 the repot t, a discussion 1111 tbe third reading. But this bill, which is es- tnially a new itwasure, we are called upon to swallow whole, ithout that 1,4 evious caution auuuh repeated consideration usually considered es still ial tul legislattve wail:owes. I perfectly cutlet', in what my nolde friend has said; and conceive that we are doing tat more than a bat we ate absolutely called it; to to Ilo in the first instaswe, iti declat ing that we are not prepared to assent to a in vane nide"' in onstuttee. the whole peoples.t' !gelato' tts be unfit and lathy exttreitte t huurse r guts and itrivilttgt•tt which have been conceded to their brethren al England alai Scotland.' ( Cheers.) It hod been observed by Sir James Graham, that previous conces- sions laid Out prattler( d peace to behind. Why a as that ? It it as not becan,c ii had been given, but because more had been withheld. The (:atholies of hula mid were not tingrati fob but t hey saw that nothing was 01111 it hick it nos safe to is it lihold, rand that a irieoltille,etaontf assent to the rosicessitms alluded to had beee foreed from the
Lords. 'floe Cut hut outs, disappointed that die benefits already conferred were not followed up by others a hid, they had a tight to de- mand. The course of legislati llll wottld he etopped altogether, if the failure of measures to pi taluee the good expected from them was held to be a sufficient reasots fur stoppiog-
" Whet I say is, let us proceed on in the course of just, amid even, and impartial legietnion. I tepeat, Sir, that I consider toy noble friend to 114i1e &Menu more than los out, Sir, a fp eat outcry has been made about toga' tc changes; but bis Majeaty s have not spokenui word about organic changes; we hate not attacked the exetchae by the House of Loots of their privileges in dealing with this measure a5 to them iterated fit. All we have to do is to deal with the bill ari it is, without inquiring whence it coulee to us, or by whom it
has been rendered such as it is; w linva to deal with it jug as if it were an entirely new bill, DON first introduced to the House—( Cheers and laughter) —and there is no Parliamentary restraint to prevent us from dealing with it as its present merits deserve, or from giving it every term of teproaeh which we may conceive it justly open to. We have to state our opinion in reference
to this bill in its present state, and to consider how near it is consistent with the resolutions of this House upon the subject : and I can fieely say, that if the measure can be put into such a shape as will insure its success here and else- where, the right honourable Membet will find that I ain as far from seeking a collision with another branch of the Legislature as he can possibly he. Here, as in the English Corporation Bill, we may feel th it it is mog desirable to avoid any collision or difference : and we hold that the best way to prevent any such collision or difference, is to maintain with the utmost heedom of discus- sion the rights, privileges, powers, and authorities of the House of Commons." (Cheers.) Mr. DILLON BROWNE would not discuss the general merits of the bill; but be would say, that if it were accepted in its present form, the result would be, that the whole Irish nation would demand the Repeal of the Union ; and he for one would return to the place whence became and agitate that question. He had promised his constituents to take the first opportunity of voting for the Reform of the House of Lords; and the treatment of the Corporation 13111 proved the neces- sity of an alteration in the constitution of that House. Impressed with this conviction, if no other Member of the House of Commons came forward with a motion for that purpose, be would himself pro- pose a measure to effeet some organic changes in the Upper House. (Ironical cheers from Me Opposition.) Sir HENRY HARDINGE complimented Mr. Browne on his candour, but could not extend the compliment further. His proposition was a most mischievous one; and if acted upon, would render the Govern- ment of this country a democracy of the worst kind. Ile thought that Ministers had no right to be surprised that the sentiments of Mr. O'Connell should be connected with theirs ; far Mr. O'Connell had frequently declared that a union of the most intimate character had been formed between himself and the very Whigs whom be last year bad branded as "base, brutal, and bloody," but whom he had now found oat were not "base, brutal, and bloody." No. Lord John Russell was no longer the malignant enemy of Ireland that Mr. O'Connell bad called him as well as Lord Grey. If Mr. O'Connell was to influence Government, whether in the House or out of it, his name would be occasionally connected with those of Ministers. As to the motion which Mr. Browne threatened, let him bring it forward, and he would find himself docked to a very short tail indeed.
The honourable Member for Middlesex had spoken of the tyrannical and oppressive conduct of the House of Lords. In what way was such conduct shown? Had not the House displayed its readiness to abolish the exclusive system of Corporations in Ireland, and to do justice to that coantry ? was the House of Lords to be censured because, when it got rid of one exclusive system, it refused to erect another, equally exclusive, in its place ? It was wry easy for the honourable Member to attack the motives of those who re- fused thew assent to measures of which he approved, and to say that equal justice was not done to Ireland. tie was of opinion, looking at the state of that country, and the great influence of the Catholic priesthood, that it was impos- sible to place Ireland at the present moment ou the same teetmg as England ;. and no longer ago than last night, the Ileuso pass,d a (.■tir ntro riat irea•ure of a peculiar nature—the Irish Constabulary Bill—sliering that the condition of society in Ireland was entirely different from the state of the population of England.
Mr. D. ROCHE said, that the demolition of Corporatii,:is would ex- cite discontent, and would not be received as a boon, lie had voted for Repeal once, and would do so again if justice was denied to his country.
Mr. WYse said, that the refusal of England to treat Ireland justly had been the cause of the Repeal cry ; which had tiot ken got up by Mr. O'Connell's eloquence solely. If perfect t(pcility of rights and advantages were refused by Parliament, it would then he for Ire- land to consider how she might obtain them by her own exertions.
Mr. SHARMAN CRAWFORD denied that the Protestants were hostile to the admission of the Catholics to equal rights with thaniselves. He lived among Protestants, and knew that they were oniie ready to see Catholics on an equality. Ile cordially concurred in the senti- ments of Mr. O'Connell's letter.
Dr. BOWRING said, that the organic change lie and his party sought for, was the change from bad to good government. The impedi • meats in the struggle for good government Must be removed ; and the consequences would be solely attributable to those who placed them there.
The amendments were read a first time, on the motion of Lord JOHN RUSSELL; and it was agreed that they should be taken into con- sideration on the 2nd of June.
2. LORD MULGRAVE'S IRISH GOVERNMENT.
A good deal of discussion occurred in the House of Peers on Tues- day, on the subject of Lind Mulgrave's conduct as Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY began by complaining of the intention of Lord Mulgrave to make Mr. Finlay, the editor of the Belfast Northern Whig,—whoin he described as an active agitator, and a friend and confidant of Lord Mulgrave,—a Commissioner of Stamps. The Earl of MULGRAVE replied, that Ire certainly knew Mr. Finlay,—who was a very respectable man, though not his intimate acquaintance ; but that he did not intend to give him the office in question; and for this reason, that the office was not in his gift.
Subsequently, in the course of the same evening, the Earl of WIN- CHILSEA presented a petition from Mr. Francis Legh, of Rose Gar- land, in Wexford, complaining that he had been displaced from the office of High Sheriff of Wexford, on the ground of being an Orange- man ; whereas he was no Orangeman, nor a person of violent politics. Lord Winchilsea impugned the right of the Lord- Lieutenant to depart from the list of Sheriffs handed into him by the Judges, anti expressed his strong disapprobation of the conduct of Lord Mulgrave, generally.
Lord Moranave explained, that he had received from the Solicitor- General what he held to be certain information that Mr. Legh was the Master of an Orange Lodge; and therefore he had refused to ap- point him, as he would any other member of a secret society, Iligh Sheriff of a county. In departing from the Judges' lists, he bad only followed the precedents set him by the Duke of Northumberland end Marquis Wellesley, who bud not gone beyond the powers estrusted to them. He bad another reason for refusing to sanction the *amnia- don of Mr. Legh to the shrievalty-
It appeared that Mr. Legit had appointed Mr. Reed as Sub-Sheriff. Now, in the unfortunately distracted state of the county of Wexford at that time, particularly with regard to the collection of tithes, a circumstance occurred, which showe I Mr. Reed to be destitute of that temper and discretion which it was most desirable that a gentleman filling the office of Sub Sheriff, and upon, whom many of the duties of Sheriff devolved, shonld possess. Mr. Roe, it seemed, empl led Mr. Reed to levy for tithes; and certain stacks sf corn were consequently seized ; the populace collected; an auction commenced. As is not unfrequently the case on such occasions, there were no bidders ; and Mr. Reed, in the fire of the famishing people, had the corn wantonly burnt and destroyed. Such an instance of want of discretion, judgment, and humanity, was, he believed, altogether unparalleled.
Lord RODEN considered that Lord Mulgrave had been guilty of a direct direliction of duty in going out of the Judges' lists for the High Sheriffs.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE defended and eulogized the conduct of Lord Mulgrave.
The Marquis of LONDONDERRY complained of the reception of Mr. O'Connell at the Viceregal table; and said, that the coolness of Lord Mulgrave's reception in the North was mainly owing to that piece of misconduct. Ile reproached Lord Mulgrave with having appointed ten Catholics to one Protestant to offices, in the Law and the Police. Lord Mulgrave also removed an officer from Dublin Castle, who had held his post for forty years under every Administration, and who therefore could riot be called a party mum With respect to a Magis- trate who had misbehaved himself, Mr. Gore Jones, he also considered that Lord Mulgrave's conduct bad been most reprehensible.
Lord MULCRAVE said, he would not long detain their Lordships from their OWII dinners, in talking about the dinner which he had given nine months ago, all he could say was, that he thought it right to pay to every person in the situation of trust held by Mr. O'Connell, the same compliment that he had paid to that gentleman. He had re- moved Mr. Bruce from the office of Gentleman Usher at the Castle, because Ile was too infirm to perform the duties of his office. He never asked what was the religion of the Policemen he appointed: the appointments wen: rewards for good conduct. With respect to the county of Armagh, where his appointment of Catholics had been especially blamed, he found upon inquiry, that the Constabulary force contained 90 Protestants and only 21 Catholics. He had appointed six Assistant Barristers; but of these four were Protestants. As to Mr. Gore Jones, he was a very efficient officer; but not being on speaking terms with the Magistrates in the county where he was placed, he had removed him to another county.
After a few words from Lords LONDONDERRY and RODEN, the sub- ject was dropped.
3. CONDUCT OF THE IRISII LANDLORDS.
In the House of Commons, on Tuesday, Mr. WALLACE moved an address to the King, to issue a royal commission to inquire into the alledged persecution and ejectment of Parliamentary voters by the latellords of Carlow. 31r. Wallace referred to the treatment of tenants by Mr. Alexander, Colonel Bruen, Lord Buresford, and other land- lords of Carlow; and detailed particulars which are notorious, having been several times mentioned in Parliament.
Mr. HARDY took occasion to deny the charge of having bribed the electors of Pontefract. lie said, that the allegations against him were false and calumnious; and that he had attempted to deny them when made, but bad been prevented from so doing. He should have denied them on some subsequent opport llll ity; but did not think it right to do so in the absence of Mr. O'Connell, who made the charges. [As Mr. O'Connell had no seat in the House at the time when Mr. Hardy spoke, this remark occasioned much satirical laughter and cheering from the Ministerial :Heathers.'
Mr. Gui.r.v said, that during his election in Pontefract, when Mr. Raphael was his opponent, he had been repeatedly told that there had not been so much bribery and treating since the election of Mr. Hardy. Ile hail heard the charge twice made against Mr. hardy, but not denied by him ; and within these three days, he had received a letter from a respectable elector of Pontefract, telling him, that he had in his possesion a letter from Mr. Hardy, in which that gentleman mentioned how large a sum his election had cost him, and that he had a good mind to have sent the letter to Mr. O'Connell.
Mr. HARDY hoped the letter would be produced.
Mr. GULLY promised to bring it down to the House on the following evening. Mr. HUME thought it would have been as well if Mr. Hardy had waited a few days until Mr. O'Connell was again in the House, before ha accused him of making a false and calumnious charge.
Colonel BRUEN denied the charge of having persecuted his tenantry; dwelt for some time on the character of a Captain Woodcock, whom he accused of being an instigator of the petitioners against him,—the Captain's offence having been, a convicton for poaching on the Colonels grounds some time ago, by the Carlow Magistrates, (though the fine imposed was not levied) ; declared his determination "to do what he liked with his own," as far as the law allowed ; and asserted the neces- sity of the interference of Government to protect the landlords of Carlow from the peasantry,—whom he termed "savages," ready to devour himself and his brother landowners.
Mr. HOPE defended the conduct of Lord Beresford. Mr. SPRING RICE strongly animadverted on the language of Colonel Bruen, which had been vehemently cheered by the Opposition. He could not agree to the motion for he considered that a royal commis- sion would be of no use; smith the present state of the country, be could not conceive that any inquiry would have the effect proposed by the mover, of informing the House as to the real state of the question. He had no doubt that on both sides intimidatiote bajl been carried to a culpable extent. Mr. WARBURTON agreed with Mr. Rice ; e no use.
in WA, there wen in inquiring into facts that were quite notoakies, Sir HENRY HARDINGE maintained, that the priests were more to blame than the landlords.
Mr. SHARMAN CRAWFORD condemmd the cruel behaviour of the landlords.
Sir R. BATESON and Mr. F. BRUEN defended the landlords.
Mr. MORE O'Fertaact. and Colonel BRUEN spoke briefly. Mr. WALLACE replied ; and the House, on a division, rejected the motion, by 123 to 52.
4. GRIEVANCES OF TIIE CANADIANS.
On Monday, Lord JOHN RUSSELL having moved that the House should resolve itself into a Committee on the Factories Amendment Bill,
Mr. ROEBUCK moved an amendment, that the House should resolve itself into a Committee to take into consideration such parts of the 31st of George the Third, chapter 31, as relate to the Executive and Legislative Councils of the Canadas, for the purpose of rendering the same efficient to the good government of those provinces. He spoke for sonic time in support of this motion ; but very frequently in so low a tone of voice that it was impossible for the most attentive listener in theGallery to get a connected view of his argument. Ile dwelt upon the numerous instances of misgovernment which bad raised the dis- content of the Canadians to the formidable pitch which it had now reached. He attributed this misgovernment mainly to the Legisla- tive Council ; and proposed as a remedy, that the Councillors, instead of being nominated by the Crown, should be chosen by the people for a longer term than the members of the Legislative Council. They should also be older men. Where there was no natural aristocracy, a body resembling the American Senate was the only one fitted for an Upper LegislativeChamber. TheCommission of which Lord Gosford was the head, had not used sufficient dexterity to cheat the Canadians ; and from that quarter no good could be expected. Mr. Roebuck ad- verted to the common assertion that the Canadians were divided into two parties, French and English ; and that as the latter were not fairly represented in the House of Assembly, it was necessary to continue the Legislative Council for their protection— How did the facts stand ? The Legislative Council was composed of Eng- lish—the House of Assembly of French. It was contended by the English party, that if the Legislative Council were made an elective body, it would be too much subject to French influence. As a proof of this, it was said that the English were not fairly or adequately represented in the Houseof Assembly. What was the fact ? It seemed that in Lower Canada the number of petsons speaking the English language ainounted to 134,000; the number of those speaking the French language to 374,000. Thus it appeared, that the English bore the propor- tion of uric-third to the French. Now, the House of Assembly consisted of 88 members, of whom 64 were said to be of French origin, and 24 of English origin. Thus. then, it would seem, that if the English population bore a proportion of one-third to the French population, so also did the number of their representa- tives in the House of Assembly bear the proportion of one.third to the repre- sentatives of the French. To show how little weight ought to be attached to the Stories of the preponderating influence of the French in the Representative As- sembly, it was only necessaty to state, that exactly the same line of argument With respect to the grievances of the minority was adopted in Upper Canada, where there were no French at all.
He utterly denied that the. French Canadians were intolerant in re- ligious matters ; but quoted a passage from a letter signed by several leading clergymen of the Protestant religion,—among others by the Chaplain to the Forces, and the son of the Chief Justice,--in which the Protestants were warned against attending the idolatrous services of the Catholic Church, as they valued the safety of their immortal souls. Mr. Roebuck then adverted to the impolitic arid injurious man- ner in which the Crown lands were disposed of in Canada, and to the advantages which would accrue to the Colony and the AlotherCountry from a judicious sale of that property, after the method pursued in the United States. He concluded by calling upon the House to take the affairs of Canada into serious consideration.
It was quite clear in the natural course of things, that the Canada's and England could not remain joined together, as they now were, but for a very small number of years. The only union that would hereafter exist between these countries, would be that arising out of their commercial intercom se with one another. That connexion might be continued ; but if England should at- tempt to continue the union by the present system of rule, it would only be the means of inducing the Canadians to make a comparison between their condition and that of other and neighbouring nations, and of the great benefits derived under the form of government which prevailed in those countries, the result of which would inevitably be, that the connexion between England and her North American Colonies would come to a rapid, and, he was au aid, a violent disso- lution.
Sir GEORGE GREY opposed the motion, on the ground that the Com- missioners now in Canada were empowered to inquire into and report upon the expediency of altering the constitution of the Legislative Council ; and he submitted, that it would be wiser to wait for their report than to act upon the opinion of Mr. Roebuck, who, as appeared from one of his published letters, had declared himself opposed to any second legislative chamber whatever. Sir George declared, that it was the anxious desire of Ministers to conciliate the Canadians ; and he much regretted that hitherto so little success had attended their efforts: but when the report of the Commissioners was received, he did hope, that without superseding the King's prerogative in any way, measures might be taken with respect to the remodelling of the Legis- lative Council, which would remove the existing discontent. As regarded the non-payment of the official salaries arising from the partial refusal of the supplies, he would only say, that be hoped that the decision of the House of Assembly would be reconsidered next ses- sion ; and in the mean while, it was not the intention of Ministers to apply to Parliament for the means of discharging the claims of the offi- .clal servants of the Government.
Mr. RORINSON denied that Mr. Roebuck could be considered the representative of the Canadians ; he was merely the agent of Papineau and his party, who however, he admitted, constituted a majority of the Canadian Representatives. He considered that the proposition to place the Crown-lands under the control of the House of Assembly would prevent the colonization of Canada by British subjects ; and he hoped that, on this ground, if on no others, it never would be sanctioned by Parliament.
Mr. HOME expressed his satisfaction with the tone of Sir George
Grey's speech ; and advised Mr. Roebuck to withdraw his motion ;. as there really seemed to be a reasonable ground to expect that GOYIM. ment would deal fairly with the Canadians.
Mr. ROEBUCK agri ed to withdraw his motion ; but he challenged Mr. Robinson to adduce u single fact in support of his assertion at the dominant party in Canada were opposed to the settlement of British subjects in the colony.
Mr. ROBINSON referred to the address of the House of Assembly to Lord Gosford, wherein they requested him not to make any further grants °fiend to the British Land Company. (Loudcries of "Oh, oh ") Sir JOHN HANMER contended, in reference to Mr. Roebuck's ap- pointment as agent for the Canadian House of Assembly, that it was unconstitutional in any Member of Parliament to accept of a salary under these eircumstunces.
Mr. WARBURTON thought that notice should be given before such a question was mooted in the House. If Sir John Hammer would bring forward a motion on the subject, it would be shown that many Members bad received salaries as agents for Colonies.
Mr. ROEBUCK referred to the cases of Mr. Huskisson and Mr. Burge, who had been salaried colonial agents, and of Mr. P. M. Stewart, who was one at the present time, in justification of his accept- ance of the Canadian agency.
Sir Romer PEEL thought Mr. Roebuck acted wisely in withdraw- ing his motion ; but solemnly protested against being supposed to be a party to any arrangement the basis of which was a promise to consider the propriety of altering the constitution of the Legislative Council.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said, that Government held out no false expec- tations to the Canadians: it was premature to give any decision on the subject ; but Ministers were prepared to consider it, and that was all that Sir George Grey had promised.
The motion was then withdrawn.
5. OBSERVANCE OF THE SABBATH.
Sir ANDREW AGNEW, OH Wednesday, moved the second reading of his Lord's Day Bill, in a rambling speech, the greater portion of which was inaudible— All must be satisfied that this question required calm consideration. It was said the bill would coerce the poor, and establish oppressive measures: he had no doubt many honourable gentlemen believed that would be the effect of the bill, but lie could assure the House that it wat not a bill to coerce the poor ; on the contrary. in would give the mechanic and the labourer the full enjoyment and benefit of the day appointed for rest.
Mr. PLUMPTRE seconded the motion.
Mr. WARD moved that the bill be read a second time that day six months. He believed that the measure would impose inconveniences on the rich, would not benefit the poor, and would be found imprac- ticable. • Captain PECHELL seconded the amendment. That part of the bill which prohibited vessels from going to sea on Sunday, would be ruinous to the poor fishermen.
Colonel THOMPSON opposed the bill on broader grounds than any that bad been stated yet— Ile would assert roundly, that there was no basis in the Christian Scriptures for the attempt to enforce the Judaical observance of the Sabbath ; and, if Membeis on the other side thought differently, he challenged them to produce their proofs. If the Catholic Members in that House were to bring in a bill, the preamble of which declared, that the sacrifice of the mass was a principal part of the true service of God, it would be considered as an indecent and un- justifiable attempt to force their own religious opinions on those who denied their authenticity : it was equally indecent and unjustifiable for Members on the other side to attempt to force their own opinions upon those who totally denitd the existence of any authority for them in the Scripture from which they were professed to be deduced.
Mr AGLIONBY, Lord JOHN RUSSELL, and Mr. PRYME opposed the motion.
Mr. C. BARCLAY had voted for the first reading; but since he had seen the bill in print, he had maturely made up his mind against it— The Sabbath was better observed in this country than in almost any other. He was happy to see the people enjoy themselves: there was no more harm done by the poorer classes playing a game of cricket, or taking a walk, than there was by the richer people riding out on horseback.
Mr. SHAW, Sir STRATFORD CANNING, Mr. HUGHES, Mr. ANDREW JOHNSTONE, and Mr. IlAnor, hoped that the bill would be allowed to go into Committee. The House divided ; and refused to read the bill, by a majority of 75 to 43.
So the bill is lost. MISCELLANEOUS SUBJECTS.
PLURALITIES Bat.. On Tuesday, this bill was reads third time by the Peers, am! passed.
RAILWAYS. In the House of Commons, on Tuesday, a discussion of some length took place on a motion by Mr. MORRISON, " That in all bills for railways, or other public works of that description, it be made a condition, with a view to the protection of the public interests, which might otherwise be seriously compromised, that the dividends be limited to a certain rate ; or that power be reserved to Parliament of revising and fix- ing, at the end of every twenty years, the tolls chargeable on passengers and goods conveyed, or the services rendered by the same. Mr. GISBORNE, Lord STANLEY, Mr. POULETT THOMSON, and others objected to the limitation of dividends, but approved of the proposed revision of the tolls and fares of passengers ; and it was finally agreed that Mr. Morrison should have leave to bring in a bill for that purpose.
ENGLISH TITHE BILL. The remaining clauses of this bill were agreed to in Committee, on Wednesday; and Lord JOHN RussEu. stated his intention of moving its recommittal in about ten days after the holydays.
Jewtstt DISABILITIES. Mr. SPRING RICE gave notice, on Tuesday, that, on the first Tuesday after the holydays, he should move for leave to bring in a bill for the removal of the civil disabilities affecting his Majesty's Jewish subjects.
STAMP-DUTIES BILL. Last night, this bill was committed pro forsta,
Oil the motion of LOI d JOHN RUSSELL, in the absence of Mr. Spring Rice. Some verbal amendments were made, and the House resumed.
REGISTRATION OF VOTERS BILL. The House went into Corn- mittee on this bill last night ; when, after some discussion, the follow- ing motion by Mr. WARBURTON VMS agreed to- " That it be an instruction to the Committee, that they have power to make provision for a permanent Court fur revising the lists of voters, and for a Couit of Appeal from the same."
OVER (CAMBRIDGE) ENCLOSURE BILL. Mr. TOWNLEY moved the third reading of this bill on Wednesday. It was opposed by Dr. BOWRING, Mr. LAW HODGEs, Mr. HUGHES, and Mr. HUME ; On the ground that it would encroach upon the privileges of the poor. Dr. BOWRING moved that the bill be read a third time that day six months. A division took place on the question that the bill be " now " read a third time; and the House decided, by 64 to 63, that the word " now " should not "stand part of the question."
Mr. GouLaung moved that the bill be read a third time that day fortnight. Be complained that the opponents of the bill did not un- derstand its provisions.
Mr. HUGHES and Mr. HUME said, that the course adopted by Mr. Goulburn was unusual, and almost unprecedented. Mr. ROEBUCK hoped that if Mr. Goulburn's amendment were carried, some other Member would move an amendment upon it, that the bill be-read a third time that day seven months : if that were lost, it might be changed to eight months, and so on until the point were carried and the bill lost.
Mr. PRYME said, the bill was misunderstood. At present the right of common was only enjoyed by a few cattle-jobbers, while poor gained nothing by the right of depasturage.
The house again divided upon the question whether the bill should be read a third time that day six months: for the motion, 88; against it, 84. So the House agreed to the third reading on that day six months. • him CONSTABULARY Btu. On the motion of Lord MORPETH, on Tuesday, several of the Lord's amendments to this bill were agreed to by the Commons. But his Lordship having opposed a motion by Colonel PERCEVAL to extend to the Friendly Brothers Societies the privilege granted to Freemasons, of entering the Police-force, Lord COLE moved that the House be counted. There were only :31 Mem- bers present, and of course an adjourmnent took place.
On Wednesday, the House proceeded with the discussion on the Lords' amendments. Lord COLE moved to include the " Friendly Brothers Societies " in the exemption which the Freemasons enjoyed. Dr. BALDWIN said, that in Cork every member of the Friendly Brothers Society was of Orange principles.
Lord Monerrit opposed the motion ; and the House rejected it by a vote of 30 to I.
The amendments were then agreed to.
SCOTTISH MUNICIPAL REFORM. On Tuesday, on time motion of Sir A. LEITti HAY, leave was given to bring in a liii to estaldisli Town-Councils in certain Burghs of Barony, Reg mlity, and others, not Perliatnentary or Royal Burghs.
Cmicmrcmn OF SCOTLAND. Sir WILLIAM RAE, on Tuesday, moved an address to the King, to direct time Church Commissiwe to report forthwith on the matters referred to them, as far as regal tied the city of Edinburgh. Th motion was opposed by Lord Jolts, RessELL ; and. after some remarks from Mr. GILION, Sir titmice CLERK, Mr. HousmAN, and Dr. BOWRING, was withdrawn.
ABERDEEN PUBLIC SCHOOLS BILL. On Monday, Mr. BAN:eel:MAN moved to refer this bill back to the Select Committee which bad already reported upon it. He stated, that the evidence of the only wit- ness examined, that of the Lord l'rovost of Aberdeen, was undisputed, and strongly in fityour of the bill ; that it wets deemed ummeeessary to examine any further witnesses; but that a majority, composed of Members who voted without having heard the evidence, decided by 12 to 8, that the preamble had not been proved. Mr. Bannerrean strongly animadverted on the system under which such pioceedings could be tolerated.
Mr. R. FERGUSON seconded the motion' and Mr. PouLTEa, Sir A. L. HAY, and Captain WEMYSS, supported it. Captain GORDON, Sir GEORGE CLERK, and Mr. LEFROY, opposed it.
The House divided; and the motion was carried, by 1.58 to 107.
DUBLIN AND KILKENNY ELECTIONS. On Monday, Mr. John MAX- WELL brought up the report of the Dublin Election Committee ; which he read to the House, as follows.
" That Diode! O'Connell, Esq. was not duly elected a citizen to serve in this present Parliament for the city of lithium. That Edward Southwell 'Dolmen, Esq. was not duly elected a citizen to serve in fir s present Parliament for the city of Dublin. Tbat George Alextuder Hamilton, Esq. is duly elected. and ought to have been returned a citizen to serve in this present Parliament for the city or Dublin. t• That John Beattie West, Esq. is duly elected, and ought to have beeu returned to serve in this present Parliament ter the city tut' Dublin. " That the petition of Robert King, John Mallet. and others, in the opinion of this Committee, is not frivolous or vexatious ; and that the opposition to the said petition does not appear to the Committee to be frivolous or vexatious.
" That these resolutions he forthwith reported to the :louse."
Mr. MAXWELL then stated that he had been directed to make the following special report to the House— 'The Committee reel it to be their duty especially to report to the House, that eight persons, sir. Matthew Madden. George Osborne, Patrick Einnucane, O. Richards. John Forsyth, Charles Dempsey, James Baldwin, and Andrew Hutchinson, were struck off the poll, as having voted from corrupt expectation. and having subsequently received money. But the Committee is unanimously of opinion, that there is no evidence that Messrs. West and Hamilton. for whom they voted, were either directly or indirectly implicated in such corrupt practices. " The Committee further consider It their duty to make known to the House, that they have found a very general irregularity to prevail in the assessment awl collection of municipal taxes in the city of Dublin ; and that. From the absence of all public notice of their imposition, the nucertainty attending their collection, and the liability of paymeut attached in many instances to various occupiers or the same premises, the exercise of their franchise is frequently subject to chfliculties. which the Committee cannot believe were contemplated by the Legislature."
On Tuesday, Messrs. West and Hamilton took the oaths and their seats.
Yesterday, Mr. O'CONNELL took the oaths and his seat as Member for Kilkenny, amidst loud cheering. lie soon afterwards presented a petition from certain electors of Duhlin against Messrs. West and Hamilton. Ile believed that the petition came within the Statute ; but if there was any doubt on that point, he would merely move that it be taken into consideration the first day after the recess.
A debate of some length ensued. Sir JAMES GRAHAM, Sir Grottos CLERK, and lair. WYNN strongly contended, that to receive time petition would be a violation of the Grenville Act, and that the uniform rule of the House was, not to allow Members who obtained their seats by the decision of a Committee to be petitioned against. The last time a petition had been presented to that effect, MIS against Mr. Lucas, who had been seated by a Committee instead of Colonel Westenra; but the House would not receive that petition.
Mr. O'CONNELL read the special report of the Committee, charging certain electors with bribery, but acquitting the now sitting Members. The opposition cheered at this. Mr. O'Connell said that he admired that cheer, seeing that the Committee bad directed the Dublin Com- missioners not to go into any evidence that would implicate IVest and Hamilton, as they were not the petitioners. Time Ye relict of acquittal therefore was merely a Scotch verdict of "not proven."
Mr. G. F. YOUNG said, that the Committee had decided upon their report in the full belief that it would be open to the electors of Dublin to petition against West and Hamilton on the grotind of bribery.
Dr. LUSHINGTON said, the question required mature consideration. The great majoiity of the House was ueacquainted with the Statutes regulating Election Committees. It must be remembered that the Dublin Committee bad excluded from their consideration the most im- portant matter of inquiry,—namely, whether the .Members whom they seated had been guilty of bribery. Under all these eileunistances, he could not refuse to receive the petition, without time for consideration.
It was at last agreed, On the motion of Mr. SPRING RICE, to adjourn the debate to Monday the 30th instant.
Another petition from certain electors of Dublin, complaining that the Dublin Election Committee had proceeded to decide upon the petition against Mr. Ruthven's return without giving ally 'motive of that gentleman's death to the electors, and reneging thin the proceedings subsequent to the death of Mr. Rinhven were null and void, was also ordered to be considered on time 30th.
REFORM OF THE HOUSE OF PEERS. Mr. O'CONNELL gave notice, last night, that on the 21st of June he should move for leave to bring in a bill to reform the House of Lords. Subsequently, just before the House rose, Mr. GRovE PRICE gave notice, that whenever the motion for going into a Committee of .Supply was wade, he should III0Ve to re- move Mr. O'Connell's notice from the Notice-book of the House, as adverse to the principles of the Constitution, derogatory- to the dignity of Parliament, andan abuse of the privileges of the House of Commons.
ADJOURNMENT OF TIIE Two HousEs. Last night, time House of Conduce's adjourned to time 30th instant, on the motion of Lord Jong RussEEL. He explained, that the holyclays this year would not be so long as in Pe734 ; that the liter holy-days that year were nineteen days, and this year only eleven and that he thought it moree convenient and agreeable to divide the l'iolydays inure equally between Easter and Whitsuntide.
The Peers also adjourned last night, to the 30th instant.
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