Bitates artb 1 ) 9race:ringsin tiarliament.

ENDOWMENT OF MAYNOOTH COLLEGE.

-renewed. r notices were also given. Mr. FERRAM) gave this adjourned debate-on the second reading of the Maynooth College Bill, the notice `ref ceremony. of,.. . ..ting innumerable petitions against the grant was In the House of Commons, on Monday, before the resumption of the :4.0oV4141 ' ' , should the bill reach that stage— Of this House that the 7th and 8th Victoria, c-'97, He Bequests Act,' whieh-received thelloyal.assent on the 9th August 1844, was a violation,af' the Act of Settlement and a contra- vention of the Oath of Supremacy; and`that the liyarnooth College Rill is eaten- !sterile encourage:and spreeldarrebgion oppeetidstmthe Protestant Reformed reli- gion established by law. And Mr. SMAMMAN Caavaroan notified thiaresolntion for a subsequent

" That the support or eidowinen -a t of any eligietts sect or sects from funds raised by compulsory enactment,. whether tithe, rent-charge, cesa or tax of any other denomination, is a violation of the rights of conscience, detrimental to reh- gfons truth, and dangerous to civil and religious freedom; and that all such grants or endowments now in existence in the United Kingdom ought to be abo- lished."

The first speaker was Xr. HAWES; who supported the measure, with a large qualification. He supported the bill itself— If the mere contents of the bill were examined, they would be found not to-form a ground either for the strong opposition with which it was assailed, or for the large andimportant consequences which, it was supposed by some would follow the passing of the bill. The bill was simply a measure for the better education of persons of the Roman Catholic religion at the College of Maynooth, and might comprehend a system of lay as-well as of ecclesiastical instruction. As far as the bill itself was concerned, it might be regarded as a measure for promoting Irish education, and an extension of the system already adopted. He did not enter into the No-Popery cry raised against this bill by. a party which was consistendrop- . posed to-religions liberty; andhe regretted to. see on this occasion united with that party some of the friends of religious freedom. 'Such being -his view with re

to this bill, and 'seeing that he had on former occasions voted in favour ofthe grant to Maynooth,-he fully and entirely concurreciin the bill as proposed.

But a 'new light was thrown upon the measure by the speech of -Mr. Gladstone; who said that it settled alfirmatiVely the qUestion of endowing the Roman Catholic Church— He would never consent to there being two distinct establishments in Ireland, one fixed on' Irish landed-property, and the otheron the Consolidated Fund. The Irish Protestant Church-was not the churchof the majority, and could not pretend to be the instructor of the mass of the people. ..Connecting with the right honourable gentleman's speech another remarkable speech made last year in re- ference to Irish policy, 'he could not but think that the present bill was the pre- cursorof a more extensive and important measure•' and, -under these ciroutt- stancea he thought it right to state that he could not give his consent to that id- timate measure, unless they-were to look to theproperty of the Irlikh Protestant - Church (respect being had to existing interests) as the source whence any endow- ment of the Irish Roman Catholic clergy must proceed. He should not vote against the second reading of the bill; but, on the contrary, should vote in favour of its going into Oommittee; and then he should support the proposition of the honourable Member for Sheffield, and should himself- make two propositionsdof which he would, give notice,—one to the effect that this grant, if made at ttil, should be an annual grant,- subject to the yearly control of 'Parliament; and the other to the effect that the provisions respecting that mere mockery of visits-Eon proposed bythe bill should be omitted.

-Sir THOMAS Fnetiawri-E (Secretary for' t Ireland) could not measure as a religions question, but-as a question whether they should give whetter or worse education to the priests Of a-population of six or -seven millions; and therefore, • without violating religions principles, he justified his vote on grounds of charity and public expediency. By restraints, he said, quoting Mr. Elliott, "they might degrade the Catholics; they might make them bad Catholics, bad Christians, or bad subjects; but they could not by such means make them Protestants. There was no effectual mode of improving the condition of Ireland but by instructing and en- lightening .the clergy and the people of the Catholic persuasion." They ought not -always to legislate for Ireland on English feelings; they ought not to decide everything according to their own views and prejudices. In Ireland, a large population is in favour of the measure; and no very strong demonstration has come from the party most strongly opposed to.Catholic ascendancy. Mr. Fox MAITLE opposed the bill, because it was not a final measure, but would' be followed by ulterior consequences. The number of petitions against itleave no doubt that there is-a strong adverse feeling in the public mind, -and that those petitions do not emanate from a central agitation in London. As to the petition in its favottr which Sir'Robert Peel quoted, [on Friday last, -from -the Remonstrant Synod of .U1ster,] it would have been the height of ingratitude not to present such a petition: 'it proceeds from the very parties who benefit by the Dissenters' Chapels Bill of last year—(" Hear, hear!" froraSir RobertPeel); a bill in favour of which the Roman Catholics of Ireland petitioned very numerously—C" Hear,lear! " from Mr. Shell). Mr. Meade -proceeded to repeat several arguments against the measure; denying the "compact," and contrasting the endowment of a -Roman Catholic establishment with the treatment of the Free Church of Scotland on its secession from the Established Kirk; when it was said that the idea of -an Establishment existing in connexion With the State, bait without the control of the State, was absurd. He could not understaad the adviee,given by Sir Robert Peel to the-Protestant landlords of Ireland, that they should treat their tenants well, -and give them sites for chapels, when he compared it with the course taken by one of his noble colleagues who had refused the site for a church though his tenants were ready to buy it; and they were driven to worship in a place where three •crees- roads meet, unsheltered from the wind and the rain: Sir James Graham knows the place well—it is on Cannoby Lea, Sir Robert Peel's accotiiit of the state of 'Maynooth was different from cme -Which he had read- " Mr. James Grant, after visiting Maynooth, says it is well fitted for the pur- pose for which it is intended; that everything is plum and.comfortable there; that every student has his own sleeping-apartment; and that they were comfortably though poorly clad. [Mr. Surna.—" Ay, but that is a Seotchman's account.' Yea that is a Scotchman's account; but he seems to have .received from those who were in charge of Maynooth-every attention and kindness; and the effect of his account -seems to be to raise -a doubt whether Maynooth is not actually adequate to the wants of those who go there." The measure is defended on the ground--of " conciliation": but Mr. O'Connell has declared that the Irish people owe it to agitation, and. that by persevering in agitation they will get all they want.

The debate went on thus, several Members rising alternately to oppose it or support it. Among its most cordial. supporters wereViscount CASTLE- JULLGH and the O'CoNou Dow. Sir CHA7.LES NAPIER did not think, with the possibility of an American war, that it was a proper time to throw -a 'firebrand into Ireland. He was not the man, in the eventOf a war, to in- vite Continental nations to carry a force into Catholic Ireland to fight against Protestant England. Mr. STA.FFORD O'BRIEN strenuously opposed the .motion. Without hesitation, but with great regret, he put thie question-to the -sapporters of liken:leaser° on his own side- "4 If the noble Member for the city af London had brought forward this self- same proposition, this very bill, word for word, when we were on the other side of ithe House, and if we had supported it, and had gone to the hustings on the question, should we have come back with a majority?" (Loud cries of " Hear, -Asar! "from the Opposition.) Mr. Cesium; WYNN (referring to a regretful allusion by Mr. Stafford ,.O'Brien to the disuse of the terms " Whig " and " Tory ") said, that he Arad never been a "Tory "; and the experience of fifty years in public life asonvince,d him that the designations of Whig and Tory are not only extinct but could not be revived. There is, however, no reason why the old Tory sparty should not support such a measure; for there is not a principle which they did not at one time support and at another time oppose. At all events, the " Conservative" party are not bound in consistency to re- .sist it; and the whole political course of Sir Robert Peel, even before the „year 1829, was such as not to prevent him from bringing it forward. As .to Mr. Wynn himself, during forty of the fifty years that he has sat in .Parliament, he has supported measures of the kind. Mr. Pitt knew (as ,Mr. Wynn himself, then Under-Secretary, also did) that Buonaparte had 4:am4e the most splendid offers to the Roman Catholic priests; and the British Minister offered to endow colleges for them. Lord Camden, in -laying the first atone of Maynooth, did not only found it in bricks and mortar; and the principles on which that College was founded were sup- -ported by Lord Castlereagh and Lord Cornwallis.

Mr. MACAULAY advocated the measure. He could not conceive how 'any human ingenuity could convert the bill into a question of principle. It As a question purely between 9,000/. and 26,000/. He could understand how those who opposed the former grant could oppose also this, but not how it should be opposed by those who sanctioned the former grant. 'Their position amounted to this—they say, that in spite of the errors of the Church of Rome, they are ready to grant her aid, provided it be a -miserable pittance, disgraceful for them to give, and for her to receive; they have no objection to the establishment provided it be a shabby establish- ment; they have no objection to board the scholars, provided the allow- once of bread and meat be so scanty that they are compelled to break off their studies and leave the College before the proper time: they have no -objection to lodge the students like pigs in a aty. Objections of that sort come with a very bad grace from any person who represents either of the .Universities-

" When I consider with what magnificence religion and science are surrounded at those places,—when I remember the long streets of palaces, those venerable cloisters, those trim gardens, and those chapels with their organs and altarpieces and stained windows,—when I remember their schools, and libraries, and museums, and galleries of art,—and when I remember, too, all the solid comforts provided in those places, both for instructors and pupils,—when I remember the stately dwellings of the principals and the commodious apartments of the fellows and scholars,—when I remember that the very sizars and servitors lodge far better than you propose to lodge these priests, who are to train the whole people of Ire- land; when 1 remember the bowling-greens, and the stabling, apd the combine- tion-rooms, the display of plate on the tables, the excellent cheer on feast-days, and the oceans of excellent ale in the buttery; and when I remember, too, from whom all this splendour and plenty were derived,—when I remember the faith of Edward the Third, of Henry the Sixth, of Margaret of Anjou of William de Wykeham, of Archbishop Chicheley, and of Cardinal Wolsey,4and when I re- member what we have Wren from the Roman Catholic religion,—when I remem- ber King's College, New College, Christ Church, and my own Trinity, I look at the miserable' Do-the-boys we give in return, and I must own I blush for the Protestant religion."

If there is a clear distinction of principle between the 9,0001. and the 26,0001., let it be stated. If the grant of 9,0001. is innocent, the grant of 26,000/. must be innocent; and if the 26,000/. can be granted without any ;violation of morality, then the House ought not to be satisfied with 9,000/. Alluding to doctrinal differences of opinion, Mr. Macaulay contended at some length, that it may be justifiable to contribute even to the-propaga- tion of religious error.

No machinery is so good but what there is some defect in it. The Scrip- tures have been translated into Hindostani, and Orientalists have discovered er- rors in the translation; human infirmity rendering a perfect version of truth itself impossible. Are religious tracts and religious teachers inspired? Do both the Churches of Scotland and of England teach truth without any admixture of er- ror? and if either, did the members of the Church of Scotland before the Seces- sion, alike teach truth—Mr. Robertson and Mr. Erskine for instance, each thought a fanatic by the followers of the error? Or is the Church of England, convulsed with different doctrine, free from error? Sir Robert Inglis would give a million or two for church-extension: a great proportion of that must go to teach error. Some alloy must necessarily be mixed with the truth. It is the effect of human infirmity. Therefore the principle which we follow is this—where truth is of such importance and value that it is in the highest degree desirable it should be known, we will not refrain from circulating it in spite of an alloy of error in it, by any means in our power. It is much better that the people of Ireland should be Roman Catholics than that they should have no religion at all.

_ There is much force in the objection founded on the Voluntary principle: but Ireland, with its Established Church receiving hundreds of thousands sterling, its Protestant Dissenters endowed, and four-fifths of its people, the poorest portion, receiving no aid from Government to pay their spiritual teachers, is an exceptional ease to which there is no parallel. But another question arose: Members were called upon -to oppose the measure, not merely on its intrinsic merits, but because it was brought forward by men who were not justly and honourably entitled to bring it forward. And cer- tainly the character a public men cannot be excluded from the considera- tion—

" Undoubtedly," said Mr. Macaulay, constantly interrupted by the loud cheers of his party, bursting out again and again, "it is of the highest importance that we should pass good laws; but also it is of the highest importance that public men should have, and appear to have, some great fixed principles, by which they khould be guided, and by which they should be guided both when holding office and when in Opposition. It is most desirable it should not appear that a mere change in situataon produces a change of opinion. I have no feeling of personal hostility, and I trust that the political hostility I shall avow by no means pre- cludes me from admitting that the right honourable Baronet at the head of the Government has many of the qualifications of an excellent Minister—great talents for debate, for the management of this House and for the transaction of public business, great industry and knowledge, and I doubt not he is -sincere in his wishes to promote the •interests of the country.. But it is not at the same time easy for me with truth to deny that there is too much ground for the reproaches of those who, in spite of bitter experience, have a second time trusted, a second time raised him to power, and now find themselves a second time deceived. It is not easy for me to deny that it has been too much the practice of the right honourable Baronet to use when in Opposition passions with which he had no sympathy, and prejudices which he °mid not but regard with the most profound contempt. Them-when in power ibis seen that a change—a change salutary, in

deed, for the country—takes place in the right honourable Baronet : the instru- ments he before used are thrown aside; theladder by which he rose is etre& away—(Continued cheering, which drowned Me conclusion of the se:stases.) But this is not a solitary instance. I am compelled to say the same course hes been pursued by the right honourable Baronet in some cases before. But 1 do net intend to enter largely upon this topic. Of the events of 1827 and 1829 1 wlil say nothing more than this, that one such change is quite enough for one man. But again the right honourable Baronet changed, and again he and those with whom he acts have returned to office. I will not now go through the course his opposition and the measures of his Government. I will only ask, whether there be one single class of men which then rallied round the right honourable gentleman which does not now declare itself bitterly disappointed? Some of these points of disappointment and disagreement I will leave to the management of the landed gentry, and I shall confine myself now to the subject immediately before the House. I ask von' what was the cry raised against Lord Melbourne's Govern

ment? It was, No Popery and I defy any one to deny that it did mate injury to Lord Melbourne s Govermnent than any other cause. Why, as the honourable Member for Northamptonshire said, and as the noble Lord the Member for Down ulso said, is there a single person in this House who believes, that if, four years ago, the Government of my noble friend had brought in this very bill, word for word identical, it would not have been opposed by the whole party now in office." Four years ago they were discussing a very different measure; and in spite of every entreaty for delay from the Whigs, Lord Stanley's Registration Bill was pressed upon the House. The House of Commons, it was said, must she purged of the minions of Popery that infested it. " But a change took place, from Opposition to power. he instruments of the right honourable gentleman were needed no more. He gained a Parliament which would undoubtedly have passed that Registration Bill. Where is that Registration Bill gone ?—a bill now positively pronounced by its author to be a bill so destructive to everything like a representative system that no Minister could venture to propose it. But then, I again ask, if the bill be gone, where is its substitute ?—It is to be found in the bill now before you for the endowment of the College of Maynooth. Did ever man hear of such legerdemain?"

Present retribution for past sins- " Is it possible that the people out of doors should not feel some indignation when they see men who when in Opposition voted against the old grant to May- nooth, now whipping in their numbers to vote for an increased grant? Can you wonder that all those fierce spirits you taught to harass us should now turn round to worry you? Exeter Hall sets up its bray—Mr. is horror-struck at seeing a still larger grant proposed for the priests of Baal at the table of Jean bel. The Protestant operatives of Dublin are calling for an impeachment, in ex- ceedingly bad English. Did you think, when you called up the devil of ref 'one animosity, that you would lay as easily as you had evoked him ? Did you

when you went on, session after session, clamouring and flattering the prejudices and passions of those you knew to be wrong, that the day of reckoning would never come? The day of reckoning has come; and now, and upon that bench, you must pay for the disingenuous conduct of years. If that be not so, then clear your public fame before the House and the country; show some clear intelligible principle with respect to Irish affairs that has guided you both when in office and in Opposition. Show us how, if you are honest now in 1815, you were honestin 1841. Explain to us why, when out of place, you stung Ireland into madness, in order to gam with you the prejudices of England; and now, when in power, -you light up England in a flame in order to ingratiate yourself with Ireland. Let us hear some argument to show that if now as Ministers you are right, you were not the most factions and unprincipled Opposition that ever sat in this place." The mischief of this spectacle of inconsistency would he increased if 'a similar display were made on the Opposition side of the House— "If I admitted that this bill would produce evils, even those evils would-be -doubled if it were to be rejected by the Wings, and we should then have before na all one vast shipwreck of all the public character in this kingdom. Therefore it is—making sacrifices not agreeable to any man to make, curbing and confining many feelings that are strong within me—I am determined to give the bill "my most determined support; and to give my support to every bill emanating from the Government, that shall tend to make Great Britain and Ireland fully and completely an United Kingdom. I give that support regardless of the obloquy that may be poured upon me, and regardless of the risk I well know I run of my seat in Parliament. Obloquy I will meet: as to my seat in Parliament, I will never hold it by an ignominious tenure; and I am sure I could never lose it in more honourable cause. (The cheers were protracted for some moments after Mr. Macaulay sat down.) Mr. SHAW energetically opposed the increased endowment, and wound up with this dehortation to Ministers— They had disappointed the feelings of the Protestants of Ireland, and excited the hopes of the Catholics; which he believed they, did not mean to realize. -He would warn the Government and the House that these were very delicate and dan gerous grounds. There were very few people in Ireland, without distinction-6f party, creed, or polities, who had not long felt, and never more so than sincelhe accession of the present Government, that Ireland had been dealt with more like a colonial dependent of the Crown than like an integral part of the empiresaml that the principle which had been too long acted upon in regard to that cocaw was diode at impera. Too long, indeed, had they been divided against imek other. "Independence and public-spirit are almost extinct from among us. The material interests of the country and its internal resources are undervalued; and the honours of the professions are sacrificed, and public interests made subservient to considerations of inferior policy. Strangers are filling all the highest offices in the country; men unqualified by any previous knowledge of the habits, wants, and feelings of the people. The Lord-Lieutenant has become a pageant which has nearly ceased to dazzle; and the so-called Irish Government is beginning to be looked upon as a bauble, and the Castle itself as being little more than a place for the registration of edicts at the behest of the Ilome Office. We are to lose the character of nationality, and not gain any indemnification. If, while the mass of the Irish people are struggling for-a national Parliament, you make those of edu- cation and intelligence who reside there to struggle for the rights and the vela) existence of their Church, then let the British Government and the British Legis- lature beware lest they find, instead of the Irish people being united to maintain the integrity of the empire, they are not united in one general spirit of discon- tent.'

Mr. SIDNEY HERBERT replied to those who said-" Let well alone," there is no "well' to be "let alone." Ireland is a country possessing many-of the same civil institutions as England, and there ought to be nothing to divide the two countries but the geographical misfortune of St. George's Channel—

He had always held it his duty to assist in the building of Roman Catholic schools and chapels; and though he might be exposed to much calumny and mis- interpretation he trusted in a short time to see every chapel on his estate within; endowment. 'He apprehended that nothing would more tend to produce harmony and tranquillity, the first step towards improvement of every kind. The debate was adjourned about a quarter past twelve o'clock. On Tuesday, before proceeding with the regular business, Mr. FERILAND moved that the petition from the Dublin Operative Protestant Associatiom

which he presented on Friday, be printed with the Votes, as he intended. to bring it before the House on the third reading of the bill. A desultory conversation arose on this proposition. Colonel RAWDOli) as the represses- tative of" Protestant Armagh," objected to printing a petition couched in language so extravagant and insulting as that which applied the terms "false, idolatrous, and Antichristian," to the religion of more than half their fellow-subjects. Mr. Rsonsoros deprecated such squeamishness, when the Queen is made to disgrace herself by swearing that the worship of the Virgin Mary is "damnable and idolatrous." Sir JAMES GRAHAM, remarking that the petition prayed for the impeachment of the Prime Minister, asked Mr. Ferrand if he meant to move the impeachment; for then Government would offer no opposition to the printing of the peti- tion. Mr. FERRAN]) replied, that he meant to make the motion of which he had given notice on the previous evening. That, said Lord JOELN RUSSELL, was no answer: and Lord John went on to point out the frivolous allega- tions of the petition; the printing of which would seem to admit that there was something plausible in it. Mr. THOMAS Dumas:BE thought that there was no great harm in the petition; and he supported the motion, on the ground that too many restrictions have been put on the right of peti- tion. Eventually, however, Mr. FEREAND, seeing that the sense of the Mouse was against his motion, withdrew it.

The presentation of petitions, now diminishing in number, having been finished, the debate went on. [The• speakers began to retrace so much of the ground already traversed—however ably and impressively at times, still repeating what had gone before—that we must only pick out the more novel and salient points.]

Major BEHESPORD, formerly a supporter of Catholic Emancipation, op- posed this measure, because Maynooth has been a seminary of agitation, and bec,ense the endowment of the College would lead to ulterior con- cessions—

He trusted that the electors of England would allow no money out of the Consoli- dated Fund for the endowment of the College. But if not, whence would the funds come? It would, he supposed, be suggested that in default of other means, the funds should be taken from the revenues of the Established Church. They might hear a First Lord of the Treasury gravely propose from the Ministerial benches to confiscate four-fifths of the revenues of the Establishment for the support of a priesthood whose tastes and manners they had elevated, and in whom they had created wants which must be supplied Then the honourable Member for Sheffield,might have the felicity of seeing his favourite bantling brought for- ward and presented, on coming of age by the honourable Baronet. (Cheers and laughter.) It would not be the first time they had witnessed such a shifting of the scenes; it would not be the first time that a play which had been well damned when played by the other side, had been acted with unbounded applause by the rival company. (Roars of laughter.)

Mr. BING supported the measure— Having felt an interest for the Catholics during the sixty-seven years that he bad sat in Parliament, he could not allow this debate to close without saying a few words. He felt that he must support this bill, not only on political grounds,but, what was much nearer his heart, on religious grounds. He thought the Catho- lics of Ireland had been worse governed than any other subjects of the empire; and he could not find in the Sacred Scriptures that he was ordered by the great God who made us all, to hate any man because he differed fron'i him in religious belief: there was no such thing in Scripture. He described how he had reasoned

county meeting into support of Catholic Emancipation, and anticipated the suc- cess of a similar process now. Who were the Ministers who brought in the measure? The Duke of Wellington and Sir Robert Reel. Did any man ijájne that ;my two people could dislike such a motion more than the Duke of, on and Sir Robert Peel? (4 laugh.) He was sure that fear had not thetiglitest Influence over their actions. They introduced the bill because they ihouglit it would be for the benefit of the country. That was their whole and sole feeling, he was confident Colonel VERNER hinted a threat, that if the Protestants of Ireland, who had dissolved the Orange lodges at the wish of the Sovereign, felt them- selves to be abandoned by the Minister, they might again unite for their Own protection.

Mr. HustE advocated the endowment as a worthy sequel in the process of conciliation to the Dissenters' Chapels Act and the Charitable Bequests Act. In India, the British Government do not refuse education to priests not of their own religion; aiding, among others, the Roman Catholics: he was sorry that Sir Robert Inglis did not inherit some of the kindness and liberality with which his father, as a member of the Indian Council, had been distinguished in religious matters. As to the charge against Sir Robert Peel, that because four years ago he refused a measure that would have been beneficial to Ireland he had no right to advance this, what pould be said of Paul, who was once a persecutor, but became convinced pf his errors?

Mr. FAHINGTON warmly supported the bill, on the ground that the annual grant was distinctly affirmed by the vote of Parliament in 1840 and 1841; but that Maynooth being, in its defective education, the source of the greatest 8113 under which Ireland suffers, it would not be prudent to leave the College in its present state; and that therefore the only re- na-ming course was to ameliorate it as much as possible—

Considering that during the ten years the late Government were in office they bad made no attempt to improve the defective state of Maynooth, and that the Ministers by whom this measure was brought forward were the same who carried the great measure of Catholic Emancipation, he thought there was no political party in this country who would say that an increased grant to Maynooth could have been brought forward with more grace or propnety than by the present government.

Mr. PATRICK MAXWELL STEWART, following a line of argument re- sembling Mr. Manic's, denounced the pre' sent startling and unlooked-for ;neasure as a sort of clumsy offering to recompense the Irish people for the injury inflicted on them by the misrule of the existing Government. He contrasted the heaps of petitions against the project with the three pre- sented in its favour.

The Earl of LINCOLN was anxious to explain that the vote he should give would not be a hesitating or doubtful one, but that he was deeply in- terested in the success of the measure, not only in its success in that House, but in its success in Ireland. He followed up several arguments already adduced, putting some with considerable force, and added some facts. Mr. Stewart seemed to suppose that Sir Robert Peel might have shunned the expression of religious feeling which had been excited against the measure— Now, he believed, and in fact he knew, that his right honourable friend at the head of the Government, not only when he brought forward the question, but when he gave notice of his intention to bring it forward last year, was well aware of the risks he was running and of the manner in which it would probably be re- ceived. And this of itself would be a sufficient answer to the taunts launched last night by the right honourable Member for Edinburgh. Why, the honour- able gentleman the Member for Renfrewshire had answered these charges, when he said that there had been no call for the measure. If such had been the case, dad if those feelings of religions opposition to which he had adverted were antics paled, what but an imperious sense of duty could have influenced the right ho nourable Baronet in bringing forward the measure ? (Cheers.) Lord Lincoln himself regarded the measure as totally unconnected with religious considerations— He saw in Ireland a priesthood placed in the midst of a population poor and ig- norant—a priesthood which must possess power and influence in proportion to the poverty and ignorance by which it was surrounded. Could he then hesitate, seeing the immense moral influence they possessed—could he hesitate to adopt means for the better education of the public? He did not despair of seeing the influence of the priesthood enlisted in aid of the common cause of the United Em- pire. He did not despair of seeing that priesthood labouring in connexion with them, not in the field of religion, but in the common field of the regeneration and improvement of the country. And such a consummation he believed to be within thew reach.

With respect to the time he thought the present peculiarly well chosen —when agitation has been suppressed, the supremacy of the law vindi- cated, the clamour for Repeal drowned in the murmur of growing industry and commercial prosperity; while external dangers there are none—none of those "little wars" bequeathed to the Government by their predecessors in office. The cup had been held to the lips of the Roman Catholics: he sincerely trusted that the House would not dash it from them. While ap- plauding the measure, however, he acknowledged that the vote in its favour was a painful one-

" I shall give this vote in opposition to the remonstrances and views and opi- nions of my constituents, men with whom during my career in Parliament I have had no political differences, and whose religious feelings on this question I cannot look on otherwise than with the deepest reverence and respect: There are other causes which render the vote a painful one. [Loud and stgnificant cries of " Hear' hear!" from both sides, as Lord Lincoln here alluded to the adverse opinion of his father, the Duke of Newcastle.] I feel that those causes—to Which it is neither necessary nor would it be becoming in me more particularly to allude—are entitled to weight, and render my vote a most painful one: but I also feel that I should be wanting in my duty to the country if I allowed considerations of this kind to induce me to hesitate or falter in the course which I think right."

Lord WORSLEY had presented one hundred and thirty-six petitions against the bill from his own constituents. he felt bound to say, that for the thir- teen or fourteen years that he had sat in Parliament, there had never been in the division of the county which he represents, so universal a feeling of opposition to a Government measure: nevertheless, his opinion did not co- incide with that of his constituents to whom it had all along been known; and therefore he should vote for 'the bill. He had to consider what th general good of the country requires- " It is tree I hear on both sides, as a matter of taunt against the Government, that this measure is brought forward by men who never before proposed any plan of liberal policy towards Ireland. I will admit the justness of this observa- tion: but am I to reject a measure which I consider a good one, because Ministers have not heretofore acted up to their present professions?"

Mr. MONCICTON M1LNES referred to his past advocacy of such a policy as the present—.

Last year he placed on the Notice-book a resolution affirming that the endow- ment of the Roman Catholic priesthood would be a wise and judicious measure. At that time he was met by his constituents very much as the bill of his right honourable friend was now received by the country. He did not mean to submit to Parliament the distinct endowment of the clergy. His object was to affirm the propriety of conciliating the Roman Catholic clergy, The gist of the present bill was, that it was the first great step towards conciliation. There had been other means of conciliation attempted, but the rational and plain course of enlisting on the side of Government the guides and instructors of the people—those who had adhered to the people through their dark and desolating history—of making, in fact, the Roman Gatholic priesthood the great links between the English and Irish people—had never until now been attempted.

He endeavoured to convince the House of the innocency of the measure. His party had been asked how far they meant to go _in conciliation: he answered, no further than is compatible with the existence of the Pro- testant Church—

They were there to represent the reason of the country against the passions of the country. If his right honourable friend were defeated on this question—and such a contingency was always possible—it would be found that every man who had been engaged in practical political life would have been found in favour of his proposal, while he believed its opponents would be found to be merely well- meaning theorists of the closet. (Much laughter.)

Mr.:Sergeant MairPErr replied to Mr. Maule's quotation from Mr. Grant's book on Ireland, by quoting from another book of the same writer a de- scription of Members of that House; beginning with Sir Robert Peel— He was quite sure every one who heard the description would say at once, "There is the man before me."." His usual dress is a own surtout—(Laughter)-- a light waistcoat, and a dark pair of trousers. (Laughter.) He generally dis- plays a watch-chain on his breast, with a bunch of gold seals, unusually large in dimensions?' (Great laughter.) Let the House listen to what followed- he wee sure the right honourable gentleman would feel it was a calumny. on bin:. "He can scarcely be called a dandy, yet he sacrifices a good deal td the graces— (Rears of laughter)—and for my part, I hardly know any public man who in better taste." This was his description of the right honourable Baro- net; and, turning over the page, he came to another description, which appeared to be underlined: it was that of the gallant officer the Member for Lincoln; and, if the gallant officer would receive it in the same good-humour with which he offered it, he would make no bones about reading it to the House. (" Hear, hear!" from Colonel Sibthorp.) "ills countenance is altogether unique: it stands out in broad relief from the countenances of all the other Members. Two or three other senators rejoice in tufts, and a few more in whiskers of decent proportion; but, compared with the moustaches and whiskers of the gallant Colonel, one feels indignant that they should be dignified by the name. (Laughter.) You hardly know whether he has a month or not, it is so completely buried amidst the surrounding crop of hair, until he begins to speak. He is extremely proud of his whiskers and moustaches." (Laughter.) Now they came to the plums in the pudding: "He will do and suffer a great deal for his party and principles; - but rather than submit to be shaved, he would see Tories, Constitution, and all, scattered to the winds." (Renewed laughter.) He came now to the honourable Member for Lambeth (Mr. Hawes)—" He speaks very often, but generally on the details of some very unimportant bill. (A laugh.) I have known no one great principle or measure with which he is identified. He is a little man, round in the face, and of dark hair." After this he should not detain the House except by the description which the writer gave of the right honourable gentleman the Member for Perth—" He is a man of exceedingly graceful proportions, and very retiring manners." (Shouts of laughter.) He was quite sure every one who had heard these specimens of the author's descriptive powers would be prepared to admit his authority, as appealed to by his right honourable friend the Member for Perth, in all matters of dress, comfort, and convenience. (Laughter.) Mr. O'Connell's words, "Conciliation Hall, I thank you," "Repeal, May- moth ought to pray for you," andso forth, had been quoted: if the measure were rejected, Mr. O'Connell might say, "British House of Commons, you who reject this bill, Repeal ought to pray for you!" for no oircurostanoe

Would give so great an impetus to the Repeal movement as the rejection of this measure.

At midnight, the debate was again adjourned.

On Wednesday, the discourse was taken up by Mr. GEORGE ALEXANDER Ilasen.row; who argued at some length, that the State is bound to enter- tain the question of truth in religion, and to support that religion which it believes to be true; that it ought not to support two religions diametrically opposed; and that in now doing so it would virtually abnegate the Protest- antism of the empire. The doctrines and principles taught at Maynooth are the ultismontane doctrines of the Roman Church, anti-social and anti- constitutional in character; and before endowing the College there ought at least to be an inquiry into the facts.

Lord ASHLEY opposed the bill. He had never known a measure more important for good or for evil in Ireland, not excepting even the Roman Catholic Relief Rill- " In the present case, we not only remove disabilities and restraints; we our- selves join that free action, and give all our energy and all out support to the principles of the Roman Catholic religion. If the plan works well, it will produce the regeneration of Ireland—(" Hear, hear! "from the Opposition)—if it works well, it will conciliate the affections of the people of Ireland, and mightily advance the prosperity of England. Bat, on the other hand, if it works ill, I believe it will la., d to the utter destruction of the Protestant Establishment, and give rise to feelings ten times more hazardous than the agitation that threatens us at the present moment."

By substituting a permanent endowment instead of an annual auxiliary grant, the State becomes the sole party to the education of the priests— the College being placed on an equal footing with the Universities of Ox- ford, Cambridge, and Dublin; and establishes a perpetual recognition of the Roman Catholic Church as one of the institutions of the empire.

"It amounts very nearly to a declaration on the part of the State, that as far as the power of enactments and statutes extends, the Roman Catholic religion shall never cease to be the religion of Ireland. Because this grant establishes, that if at any time there shall be an apathy on the part of the Roman Catholics of Ireland as regards the support of their religion—if they should have a disincli- nation to expend money on their Church, the State will step forward and supply those funds which the Roman Catholics themselves will not provide." The endowment of the Roman Catholic priesthood must inevitably fol- low; or what becomes of the policy of "elevating" that clergy, who are more degraded by depending on a pittance gathered from door to door than by any other cause? If their system of agitation is to be broken down, they must be rendered independent. But then there would be the enor- mous, almost ludicrous contradiction of two coexistent established churches In the same country; one, too, of 7,000,000 people receiving 500,0001., and one of 1,000,000 receiving double that amount! And the Church of Ireland must be deprived of its missionary character. Lord Ashley hoped that he should not be considered as animated by a feeling of hostility to- wards the people of Ireland- " I confess that the whole history of that island appears to me to demand not only the sympathy but the repentance of the British nation. I never can read of those terrible occurrences without a feeling of shame; and there is no conces- sion which I would not make, short of the concession of such a principle as this, for the satisfaction and benefit of Ireland. If I thought this concession would really content the people of Ireland, I do declare that I would pause even in this matter before I came to a decision. But, in the first place, I never saw any good arise from the concession of a principle; and, in the next place, we have heard language from no less important a Member than the right honourable gentleman the Memberfor Dungarvan during the present session, which shuts out all hope That the people of Ireland would be satisfied: on the first day of the session that right honourable gentleman said, In Ireland it was a point of honour with Ca- tholics that the University of Dublin should be thrown open.'" Mr. Gourffinnw began with the remark, that in some respects the im- portance of the measure was greatly magnified, since it was only an addi- tional grant of 17,000/. a year; and they had had evidence of the effect which the concession was calculated to produce in Ireland. As to Mr. Shell's declaration, his poetical imagery is somewhat of an excuse for the indiscretion of his assertions. Whether the State should extend its favour tO all religions is beside the question; which is simply, whether Maynooth College should be rendered effective for the purpose for which the Legisla- ture had endowed it? Members had made use of the petitions against the bill: the drift of the arguments and prayer in almost all of those petitions was against the grant altogether; a proposition not advanced by any Member in the House. If they rejected the bill, they could not stop there, but must announce to the Roman Catholic body that a time has now come when, instead of further reasonable concession being mode to their wants and demands, a privilege which they have enjoyed for fifty years is to be withdrawn. It was a mistake to suppose that the College is now to be endowed for the first time: the original bill appointed trustees for the pur- pose of "establishing, endowing, and maintaining the said College." Mr- Gonlburn contended, that to deprive Roman Catholics of education, espe- cially by opposing obstacles of poverty and discomfort, is far from being real toleration, and little to be distinguished from prohibition by law. He could not consent to keep the inmates of Maynooth in their present condi- tion, with the hope that he should force their conversion to his own faith. On the other hand, education facilitates the introduction of purer doctrine: the Reformation did not rise till literature and science illuminated the con- vents on the Continent. To stop the progress of education, them is to stop the progress of Protestantism. He denied that the bill necessarily led to ulterior measures-

" I think I need scarcely say that Land those with whom lain associated, can he no parties to that invasion of the Protestant Establishment, either as regards its Tights, its privileges, or its income, which has been recommended to us by various gentlemen on the opposite side of the House. No inducement will induce me to depart for a single moment from those principles, or to take any step which would sanction the appropriation of the property of the Established Church to any purposes not connected with its maintenance and welfare. But, Sir, we know that in the last fifty years the endowment of Maynooth has not produced the effect now apprehended. What may happen in the next century, or what may be the views of Parliament at a future period, it would be a waste of time to consider. As far as regards the endowment of the Roman Catholic priesthood, we know that they have stated that they would not accept any endowment from the Crown. We further know, that although their emoluments are derived from their flocks, they are in many cases not inferior to those which are enjoyed by Protestant clergymen in the same district."

After alluding to the utterly successless attempts to stop the grant—the largest number that could be found to vote for that step did not amount to fifty—he replied to Mr. Macaulay's charge against Sir Robert Peel, that although the measure was a good one, it ought not to be brought forward

by him. Was that any great proof of Mr. Macaulay's benevolence towards Ireland?- " Ten years his party were in possession of the Government, and yet at no period of that time did they show any intention of making any addition to the grant to Maynooth. But the fact was, that during all that time they felt they were associated with a number of persons who were Voluntaries' in religion, as they have been called in the present debate; and they did not dare to fare the oppo- sition that they would have raised. The right honourable gentleman, then, in effect said, that there was one party, who dared not encounter the difficulties besetting the measure when they had the power, had an exclusive right to bring in this measure; but the other party., who dared to encounter those difficulties, ought not to have brought it forward. Where is Ireland to look for supporters in the time of need, if this is the case?"

But in 1840, when the House was discussing the "want of confidence," Mr. Macaulay made a remarkable speech, which was utterly at variance with the terms that he employed in this debate-

" The right honourable gentleman's object then was, to endeavour to dissa-- tisfy the usual supporters of my right honourable friend, by stating what would be the consequences if he were raised to power; which he did by referring to what took. place in 1829. He said—' The right honourable Baronet had been raised to power by prejudices and by passions in which he had no share: his followers were bigots—he was a statesman. He was calmly balancing conveniences and incon- veniences; whilst they were ready to prefer confiscation, proscription, civil war, to the smallest concession.' The right honourable gentleman also said—' I must be permitted to say, it has been his misfortune, and the misfortune also of the public, that it has been his fate, for a long time, to be at the head of a party with whom he has less sympathy than any head ever had with any party. let the right honourable gentleman, who then charged my right honourable friend with having no sympathy with his party, comes down to the House in 1845, and does not scruple to charge him with having professed principles with which he had not the slightest sympathy, and prejudices which he regarded with profound con- tempt. One of two alternatives follows; for both statements cannot be correct. If the right honourable gentleman were here, I would ask him which he would stand by ? The right honourable gentleman, in the speech I have voted, goes on and enumerates other instances of my right honourable friend's going beyond his party. He states of my right honourable friend, that 'he chose the good path

i —he performed a painful, n some sense a humiliating, but, in point of fact, a most truly honourable pare; and yet on the former evening, the right honourable gentleman did not scruple to attribute to my right honourable friend a line of conduct inconsistent with the honour for which he then gave my right honourable friend credit. I agree with the right h i honourable gentleman n the remark he made in the speech I have quoted= The right honourable baronet is still the same; he is still a statesman.'"

Lord BERNARD argued, with elaborate quotation, against the existence of any compact to guarantee the grant; and he reminded Mr. Wyse, that in the time of Elizabeth the whole Irish Church professed the Protestant faith. In supporting the motion, Viscount JOCELYN alluded to the pain which he felt at differing from near connexions in respect to the present measure. [The Earl of Roden is his father.] But the first speech that he ever made in Parliament was in favour of the grant to Maynooth.

Mr. BRIGHT opposed the motion, on the ground that an institution purely ecclesiastical was to be paid out of the taxes. The payment of the priests- must follow, and then there would be a new church established in Ireland. The ineasure will not sooth Irish discontent, because that does not ori- ginate in the ill clothing of the priests but in the pauperism and destitution of the people. Its real object was to tame down the clerical auxiliaries of agitation: it was a sop to the priests—hush-money to prevent their pro- claiming to Europe the sufferings of the population, meant to make them as tame as the clergy of Suffolk and Dorsetshire. Mr. Bright went on to attack the Protestant Church of Ireland as the root of the evils of that country, with allusions to Archdeacon Ryder, and to church-rates in Eng- land; and praises of Nonconformity—

When he looked back to the history of this country, and considered its present condition, he must say, that all that the people possessed of liberty had come, not through the portals of the cathedrals and the parish-churches, but from the conventicles, which were despised by honourable gentlemen opposite.

Lord Joint MANNER8 asked, if it was to the conventicles that the English nation owed Magna Charta? And he congratulated Sir Robert Inglis on his new ally. He then turned to the question before the House; calling to mind how, in 1843, he ventured to express a hope that Ireland might be legislated for in the spirit of Stafford, Tyrconnell, or Pitt. He warmly repudiated the notion that the Roman Catholics are to be accounted " Antichristian ": our Church nowhere imposes such a tremendous be- lief; but on the contrary, the Church of Rome, though an erring branch, is to be regarded as a branch of the universal Catholic Church. The Irish [Protestant] Church is said to be in danger: it is not from the Vatican, the Jesuits, or Maynooth, that the Irish Church is in danger; it is from those who would have her separate herself from the rest of Catholic Christendom—who fraternize with the Puritans, and denounce priestcraft with the Presbyterians. It is said that Maynooth has failed: has the failure, after all, been so great? and may it not rather be laid to the door of St. Stephen's than of St. Patrick's? Four hundred youths are not to be taught the accomplishments of Padua for 9,000i. a year. It was said, too, that the priests are deficient in loyalty, and do not inculcate passive obedience— But our forefathers, it must be remembered, persecuted the priesthood; and we, as well as we can, still continue to persecute them. He denied that the ac- cusations brought against them are true to any considerable extent. The pas- toral letters which this winter had produced from the pen of the titular Arch- bishops of Armagh and Dublin, might, be thought, be taken as some proof of the spirit which animates the heads of the Roman Catholic Church. It is not the doctrine taught at Maynooth which prevents the Roman Catholic priesthood from being so successful as they all should wish in keeping down agitation in Ire- land; but it is the struggle of after life the sense of undeserved opprobrium, the anomaly of their position, which, beaten down as it were to theoretical loyalty, they learned in that poverty-stricken cloister, and which compels them, by means that they do not approve of, to seek, if possible, the political regeneration of their country. And have the priests educated in Maynooth failed in their highest and holiest functions ? Has the morality of the country deteriorated under their tutelage? Are the men less sober, or the women less chaste, than under the old regime? Quoting the words of Dr. Christopher Wordsworth, that "the English nation pays for Maynooth, and the Pope governs it," Lord John said that he would at once frankly recognize a power which is admitted to be so great—he would send a Minister to the Vatican and receive a Nuncio at St. James's. He concluded by expressing a hope, that this new spirit of munificence to the Roman Catholic Church foretokened a return to sounder and more generous principles in the Church of England—the advent of that happy day when the votaries of both faiths, with muttud confessions of

pride and hardheartedness, whir tears of sorrow and joy, might kneel before the common altar of their common faith.

Mr. Stamm supported the measure, with some playful sarcasm on Ministers, who have discovered that "concession has" not "reached its utmost limits," He agreed with Mr. Ward, that Sir Robert Peel is the greatest " doer " of his age: he has " done " Emancipation, and in like manner he will " do " Maynooth- " In all the contrasts which that right honourable gentleman's career affords, there is none which history will deal with so leniently as the contrast be- tween Mr. Secretta7 Peel and Sir Robert Peel the Prime Minister—between the yeung, hot, proscribing partisan, and the beneficent ruler—the Octavius of into- lerance merged in the Augustus of conciliation. He denounced the hypocrisy which forbids the Roman calendar yet permits the Pagan mythology in our schools—excludes Dens and sows Lempriere broadcast. And he gave some counsel to the raisers of the No. Popery cry-

" Would that these No-Popery enthusiasts—and I do not mean there are any enthusiasts in this House—would, in their calmer hour, if they ever have one, look back for the last two hundred years, and pass in review all the men they have believed in, from Titus Oates down to Lord George Gordon, and from Lord George Gordon down to—our own thee; and then I think they would agree with me, that the superstition is not all upon one side. If at the same time they should take a retrospective glance at their literature, their architecture, and their taste, I think they will be less satisfied than they new are that they and they alone are the Providential instruments of England's greatness. They will at any ride find out that they have always been, as they always will be, betrayed by their own leaders. The moment a great Protestant champion enters this House, still flushed with the plaudits of Exeter Hall, with the doxology perhaps still ringing in his ears, determined tocarry all before him, somehow or other I observe common sense acts upon him as religion acts upon a Dervish; he goes round—(Great cheers and laughter)—he kicks a little, but still he goes round: it is a Parliamentary polka, now practising by the whole of that bench, from the right honourable gentleman the Member for the University of Cambridge down to the honourable Member for the County of Selkirk." (Renewed laughter.) He ridiculed the new "Anglican Opposition," and Mr. Gladstone, sup- posed, up to Friday night, to represent the party in the House— The party is strong in dialecticians. It claimed illustration also in the right honourable gentleman's retirement from office: "De eivitate decedere maluit quam de sententie "—he left the Cabinet, but kept his theory. "In that cloud of varie- gated phraseology in which he, as usual, the other night wrapped and shrouded his mysterious divinity, there was only one phrase which was intelligible to vulgar mortals like myself. He said, that notwithstanding his most cherished convictions; he would vote in favour of this bill. So then, it is most clear that his most cherished convictions' end his votes are at issue. But about the mere vul- garity of votes the right honourable gentleman cares little; for upon this very question he has voted all ways. He voted first against, then in favour of the grant; he then went out of office because the grant was to be increased; then the measure involving the increased grant came to a first reading—he did not vote at all; we are now at the second reading—he is prepared to vote in favour of it. And is any honourable gentleman—is the right honourable gentleman himself—quite sure, that upon the third reading ho will not find equally good reasons for voting against the measure?" (Laughter and cheers.)

The debate was adjourned soon after midnight.

After the petitions had been presented on Thursday, Mr. Tatteaen,geve notice that on going into Committee to provide for the Maynooth grant out of the Consolidated Fund, he should move the addition of words to the effect that the payment should be thus met until provision for the purpose should be made, either by any act authorizing an assessment on lands in Ireland to an amount equivalent to the reduction made by the Tithe Com- mutation Act, or by devoting to the purpose moneyout of any surplus in the hands of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners in Ireland—as Parliament might deem most advisable. Colonel SIRTHORP also moved for a return of the number of petitions for and against the measure; but was told that the information would be furnished by the report of the Committee on Peti- tions; and he withdrew his motion.

The discussion was continued by Major CUMMING BRUCE. After some hits at Mr. Gladstone,—he attacked the Irish Bishops for not having ful- filled the promise on the faith of which the Roman Catholic Relief Bill was passed, that there should be no more invasions of the Protestant eon- stitution— Looking at the present state of Ireland and the professions of loyalty and tran- quillity on the faith of which the Relief Bill was passed, he thought the Duke of Wellington could not be censured if he spoke of many of the priests of the Catholic religion in somewhat the same terms as the Duke of Ormond used two hundred years ago of the Roman Catholic Bishops. The Duke of Ormond was reported by Walsh to have declared, "For these twenty years, in which I have had to deal with these Roman Catholic Bishops, I never found any of them either speak the truth or hold to a promise." (Loud cries of" Oh, oh! ") He did not say that this could now be applied in its fullest sense—(" Oh oh!")—but he did say that the promises which were made to the Duke of Wellington had been essen- tially violated.

Mr. GLADSTONE made an explanation of something which had fallen from him on Friday about payment of the Roman Catholic clergy— What he had said on that suk,ect, as far as he recollected, was' that he felt that the acceptance of this measure would put out of the way and dispose of the religious objection to the payment of the clergy. He could not conceal from him-

pelf that if they voted for that bill in the present session, they could not in a fu- ture session profess to oppose the payment of the clergy of that Church. At the same time he stated, that it appeared to him that other great questions would arise in connexion with the subject of the payment of the Roman Catholic priest- hood, and that objections might be made to it which mieht or might not prove in surmountable. Although what he either said or meant was unimportant in itself; lie wished to exempt the Government from the supposition that he had revealed some covert intention which they entertained. He ought to say, in justice and in common fairness to them, that he had no knowledge or recollection which led him to suppose that they entertained any intention of this sort.

Sir GEORGE GREY warmly advocated the measure, in spite of the strong remonstrances of many among his own supporters. He described the "Re- formation" as it was effected in Ireland— "-At the time of the Reformation—the Reformation properly so called—we found large and extensive revenues in the possession of the Irish Roman Catholic clergy; and what, I ask, was the course pursued? Why., by an act of arbitrary,, and, I am prepared to say, of unjustifiable power, we depraved the Roman Catholic clergy of those revenues, and transferred them to the clergy of another faith. By a strange misnomer, also we called that change, in a country where the people generally have remained Roman Catholics down to the present day, a Protestant Reonnation and by an equally strange misnomer, an equal contradiction in terms, we called the clergy of the endowed Church, upon whom we had conferred the Roman Catholic revenues, the 'Church of Ireland:"

Be entered into some controversy with the petitioners; many of whom

oppose the measure on the ground thak.all State endoetnenta_of religion are objectionable-

" These petitioners would have more, reason on the side if„ within any men- tionable time, they had a reasonable hope of carrying out their principle, andif

withdrawing all state -endowments. But from the earliest period throughent Europe, state endowments have been the universal practice and custom: prastii.. espy, the hope.of carrying out the favourite principle is altogether chimerical; 404 it is ,unfair to invoke that principle as a,meaus of opposing &measure intendedfore the benefit of the Roman Catholics of Ireland."

He agreed in what Mr. Disraeli said about a Government having settled::: and definite principles, and about the use of a constitutional Oppositicatz,. but there are other duties which an Opposition has to perform besides die. placing the Government; and if the Opposition were now to unite with Sir Robert Inglis, as they might do in deference to popular feeling, and place the Government in a minority, they would be disregarding Mr., ,Disraelfs advice not to climb to power by the arts of the gentlemen on the, Treasury benches. He could not but remember the bitter feeling engen- dered in Ireland by the conduct of the Conservative Opposition in regazd„ to the Irish Corporation Act—paring it down to the narrowest _limits, and,:

allowing it to go in a spirit of contumely and reproach. But he now bee. hayed that Sir James Graham would be eager to recall his ill-omened, expression that "concession has reached its utmost Ruts"; for he thought) he saw the dawn of a brighter day for Ireland-

" Sir, when 1 observe the new spirit which has come over the minds of gentle,. men opposite, and when I see the generous and confiding manner in which thai bill hasiaeen accepted by the Roman Catholic Members of this House, represent-

ing, as I doubt not that they do, the feelings of their countrymen generally of the, same faith,—I say again, that I cannot help thinking that a brighter day WI

dawned upon Ireland. Beyond this, I cannot but believe that the right honour, able gentleman the First Lord of the Treasury, however the party opposite-maxi be broken into divisions, and however distracted it may be, still possesses- the power, if not of moulding the opinions, at least of guiding the votes of those by

whom he has hitherto been supported; and at least, exercising the trust repw4: in me as a Member of theLegislatare, I cannot consent to oppose a measure which. I believe to be eminently just to the inhabitants of Ireland, and the rejection.or which, as a necessary consequence, I should consider to be exceedingly dangerono:. to the security and best interests of this country."

Colonel SIBTRORP, premising that he had been educated in Protestant' principles, proceeded, with more than usual impressiveness, to speak thus—. He had seen—he had heard—in that very House—only last night too-- (Laughter, which was renewed at every subsequent sentence)—he had-heard, he, must say with astonishment, ay more, he must say with disgust—that was the word—disgust—he had seen an honourable and learned Member [Sergeant, Murphy] introduce a book—he [Colonel Sibthorp] had never read and never meant to read; a compilation of some present or quondam friend of that honour... able and learned gentleman, from which that honourable and learned gentlemana had introduced quotations, with a view no doubt to please, to tickle the fancies ofr

those who wished those fancies tickled; quotations, he begged to say, more fit for him to utter in places in which he never met him and never should meet him„ and where, if report said true, be was wont to "set the table in a roar," than for that serious assembly and on a subject of so revered a nature. Doubtless those. quotations would be entertaining and valuable in the eyes of a member of the.

Beefsteak Club, or where, he was told, though rarely; very rarely, he believed,., the honourable and learned Member for Cork went—those societies of Tempe-- ranee—but which, if he really did visit, he felt satisfied the honourable and: learned Member returned a true specimen of what he had always thought of the lessons taught in all Temperance Societies. Thus the Colonel proceeded. At length, adverting to the subject before. the House—a measure as foreign to the constitution as it was repugnant,. to the habits of the people of this great Protestant empire—he said—

Really, he should have doubted, had he not known it, whether the right honour-. able gentleman at the head of the Government was a Protestant,. or a Romanist,,

or a Mahommedan. (Loud laughter.) He said so—he repeated it. Such was

the opinion he had formed; and the day he was sure would arrive when they, would hear, nay, when they would see, that right honourable Baronet sittiniz

cross-legged—(Roars of laughter)—he said it—sitting cross-legged in liar

proper character of a Mahommedan; and also—some time or other—perhape before—perhaps after—embracing his Holiness the Pope with the greatest affec-

tion and regard. (Great laughter.) He confessed he had lost all confidence ill, that man. But there was yet something to look for—yes, there was hope: has could see their days were numbered. He replied to the assertion that he would. sooner sacrifice his principles, than be shaved—

He told the right honourable Baronet [Sir Robert Peel]—yes, he told lihn thew

and there, that he would rather not only be shaved—(hhouta of laughter at he would go much further, he would rather not only beshaved--(Laughter but he would submit to have fils head shaved off—( Great laughter ).—sooner than ho, would forget that he was a Protestant in heart—that he was born a Protestant, that he was educated a Protestant, and that, with the blessing of God, he would' die in that faith in which he had been reared. (Loud cheers.) Mr. BLACRSTONE observed, that the allowance to the Society- for the Propagation of the Gospel in Foreign Parts had been discontinued; and surely the discontinuance of the grant to Maynooth College would be no greater violation of a "compact." Mr. TRELAWNEY admitted the objections to State endowments urged by his constituents, and many objections even to the particular measure; as a premium to disaffection, and so forth: but for his part he could not for. get entirely the special circumstances of that country—the fact that some,- thing conciliatory must be done, and that immediately; the consideration that had an Irish Parliament still existed, there would probably have been a splendid provision for the education of the priesthood.

Is not the existing grant more mischievous than the proposed one—being merely enough to create a feeling of inferiority in the Irish people? Many good measure might be introduced for Ireland; but what use is there in- paper reforms, abide

owing to the balance of parties, could not be realized? It is a time when a Liberal Member ought to risk something for peace, to sacrifice popularity to

render government possible; and it would seem most ungracious ins person pro- fessing to be guided by measures only, not to come forward and support those who also risk munch, from a belief that something must be done for Ireland, that the present measure would tend to conciliation, and that, under all eireune- stances, no sounder measure would be successful.

Sir JAMES GRAIIAM was satisfied, that whatever excitement might exist against the measure among the people, the protracted debate would not be

without its effect as an appeal to their reason; and he anticipated the verx best results. Deploring these religious differences, and the lossof confidettee on the part of supporters, Ministers still felt that this was a measure whit* they could not have delayed-

' I am bound to say, that I do not consider this measure' by itself, is eapabie of redressing the wrongs or giving pacification to Ireland. (Cheers from the OA- position benches.) But it is also my duty. to add that if I do not much inistides this is the measure most practicable and most efficacious, as the coisuimsoement a thappier. state, of affairs in that country. (Renewed deers.) I must also say, still further, that I am confidently persuaded, that unless you lay the foundations °Leach policy by the adoption d. this measure, any others would fail of accom- *king that end." (Loud cheers.)_ ffir James set off against each other the conflicting and incompatible ac- cusations brought against Ministers,—by some that they are not true-to the Protestant faith; by Mr. Bright, that they resort to dishonest methods to buy off opposition to the-Protestant Establishment in Ireland. Sir James himself was accused of inconsistency in propounding a measure of this de- scriptiOn,—he, a colleague of Lord Stanley, in whom originated the Church Tim:moralities Act and the Tithe Composition Act; and of Sir Robert Peel, vahn adopted the system of National Education. Mr. Shaw, closing with a-passage that would very well have suited Conciliation Hall, complained that in Ireland " strangers " are appointed to the highest places: Sir James eannaerated several of the highest appointments in the Church and on the Bench made by the present Government, Irishmen being in all cases ap- pointed; and then he added— "But if the right honourable gentleman really believes that the days of Pro- testant ascendancy,' in the old sense, can be maintained—( Cheers from the Op- position benthes)—I must tell him that those days are past. (Renewed cheers.) Mar one will not be-responsible for any attempt to govern Ireland upon those principles." (Cheers.) Sir-James Graham said, that he had never expressed an opinion, in- dividually, even against the endowment of the Roman Catholic clergy; though he aid object to a motion of the kind by Mr. More O'Ferrall, about- three years ago, that the priests had declared their unwillingness to accept State payment. He had himself no religious scruples which would pre- vent his advocating such a measure-

" The vital difference between myself and noble lords and honourable gentle- men opposite, if such an arrangement were feasible, and if such an endowment could by common consent be made, has always been with respat to the propriety (I will not use any stronger term) of drawing that endowment from the pro- perty of the Protestant Church established by law. Upon that point I have always differed from them decidedly. I have adhered steadily and uniformly, and! still adhere, to an insuperable objection to any such course; and from that point I cannot swerve. That difference between us still exists; and I am not aware of any circumstances likely to affect it."

He responded to Sir George Grey's call upon him to retract the expres- sion "concession has reached its utmost limits "-

He begged the House to remember the circumstances under which it was said. Government had introduced measures to enlarge the County franchise, and to make the. Municipal franchise identical with that of England. Simultaneously with those measures, not proposed in an illiberal spirit, there were formidable demon- strations of physical force in Ireland, and Government brought forward the Arms Bill ; seeking to oppose measures dangerous to peace and to the country by the ordinary operation of the law. In the debate on that bill he did use the expression that "concession had reached its utmost limits." "I do not think it quite fair to fasten upon a particular expression used by any Member in the course of a debate, especially when an explanation has been offered—and that explana- tion I hold in my hand, which was offered within a fortnight from the use of the expression itself. But I will do more; I will not only admit that expression, but I will avow also my regret at having used it. (Cheers.) I say, that when the feelings and the interests of a nation are concerned, even an inadvertence of a Minister of State becomes a serious matter. I therefore now make this reparation fully and freely. I am sorry that I used the expression—(Loud cheers)—if I have given offence to Ireland I deeply regret it; and I can only say from the very depth of my heart, that my actions have been better than my words." (Renewed oliee•rs from both sides of the House.) At that time the public mind of Ireland was so soured, that even the beneficial political measures which he had mentioned produced no improved feeling. He described a new policy— Acting upon a suggestion first made to them by Lord Palmerston that without proposing any direct endowment of the Roman Catholic Church in 'Ireland, there was a feasible and practical mode of gradually, and with the cooperation and the assistance of the wealthy landlords, of progressively leading to fortunate and happy results, Government introduced the Bequests Act; and that measure has certainly produced effects which have far exceeded their expectation, and hats satisfied them that it was a measure which, if it were honestly followed up, would pmduce the most happy consequences. On that measure, however, the Roman Catholic Church were divided; but subsequently, Government received a declara- tion from the Archbishops and Bishops of that Church in Ireland, asking for an increased, grant to the College of Maynooth. " Here, then, was an opportunity, if there was nothing inconsistent with our duty to our Protestant Sovereign, and to the Protestant Church in Ireland, to propose a measure which would meet with assent. Endowment was not the question: the Roman Catholics have de- clared that they will not accept of endowment, and we are not prepared to give or to offer it; but here was a Parliamentary grant to be increased, and the Roman Catholic Hierarchy. said, If you will propose it, we will accept it'; and in prin- ciple it is not only Just but expedient. Hence the origin of the measure we now propose'

After enforcing several arguments for the bill, Sir James Graham con- cluded by saying- " The rejection of a measure like this, after its deliberate sanction by the Crown, and its preparation and proposal by her Majesty's Government, will be regarded throughout Ireland as the triumph of religious antipathy over reason and justice; and-this result will be received there with a sentiment of bitter disappointment, and with feelings of dismay approaching to desperation.' At midnight, the debate was for the fifth time adjourned.

SPEAKERS IN TILE FOREGOING DEBATE [101B Friday to Thursday.] For the Government measure—(Conservatives) . Gladstone, Sir Thomas, Fre- mantle, Viscount Castlereagh, Colonel Thomas Wood (Middlesex), Mr. Charles Wynn, Mr. Sidney Herbert, Mr. Pakington, Mr. Monckton Milnes, Mr. Montagu Gore, 11r. Goulbeirn, Lord Jocelyn, Lord John Manners, Mr. Smythe, Lord Courte- nay, Mr. Charles Wykeham Martin, Sir James Graham; (Liberals) Mr. Roebuck, the Earl of Arundel and Surrey, Mr. Hawes, Sir Charles Napier, Mr. Macaulay, the O'Conor Don, Mr. William Cowper, Mr. Byng, Mr. Hume, Lord Worsley, Bergeant Murphy, Mr. Ellice Sir William Clay, Sir John Easthope, Mr. Rather- & , Mr. Redington, Sir George Grey, Mr. Rice, Mr. Trelawney, Mr. Tuite, Mr. Carew, Lord Leve,son. Against the measure—(Conservatives) Mr. Colquhoun, Mr. Grogan, Mr. Stafford O'Brien, Mr. Lefroy, Mr. Gregory, Mr. Frederick Shaw, Major Beresford, Colonel Verner, Mr. George Alexander Hamilton, Lord Ashley, Lord Bernard, Major Cumming Bruce, Colonel Sibthorp, Mr. Plumptre, Mr. Spooner, Mr. Maclean; (Liberals) Mr. Fox Mania, Mr. Patrick Maxwell Stewart, Mr. Bright.

In the House of Lords, on Monday, the presentation of several petitions against any increased grant to Maynooth College, gave occasion to remark- able declarations in favour of the measure from several of the Peers who presented the hostile petitions,—the Marquis of ANGLESEY, Lord Bitotainam„ Lord BATHERTON, Lord Csairnatz, the Bishop of ST. Davin's, the Earl of. ELLESBOROUGH, and the Earl. of ST. Gem/mass

all these, Peers spoke in the moat emphatic terms, however briefly;son* went a little further— Lord BROUGHAM [who _presented a petition from the Wesleyans of %Miami, don].—He did not agree with the petitioners, that the Legislature would down upon this nation the judgments of God by agreeing to give a modera* portion of the national income to defray the expenses of teaching those who were, to guide the people away from the Judgments of God by teaching them to linen good life.

Lord liartinirross—" A more honest and salutary measure has never begat brought before Parliament." Lord CasissEtt—Like his noble friends behind him, he differed entirely fromc the petitioners, and regretted that this proposed additional grant to Idaynooths had been so long deferred; but now it was brought forward, he rejoiced to thinks he should have an-opportunity of giving it Lis most hearty support

The Bishop of ST. DAVID'S [presenting a petition from Carmarthen]—" At the same time, while I discharge my duty. in presenting this petition, and also, I hope, do justice to the motives and intentionsof the petitioners, I feel it right tes state that I cannot support the petition, but wholly dissent from it, both as to the,

object of it and as to the grounds upon which it ."

Lord ELLENBGROUGH— In my judgment, te.c.rerie:issure is entirely in accord- ance with the true policy to be pursued towards Ireland."

RAILWAY SPECULATION.

In the House of Lords, on Tuesday, Lord BROUGHAM revived the subject: of railway speculation; prefacing his remarks with two cases stated in peti- tions which he presented—

The first petition was from Lady Georgina Fans, sister of the present Earl of

Westmoreland; who possessed by will an ancient mansion of great beauty, in thiss county of Somerset, built by lingo Jones, having pleasure-grounds to correspond. In December last, she learned that a railway was to pass close to her mansion... In January, an agent called upon her; and to him she expressed strong dislike or the proposed route. Oh leaving her, the agent went to one of her tenants, and by rspresenting that he had the landlady's assent to the railway., obtained that of the tenant. The railway company avowed that they did not intend to enter into, any arrangement with anybody until the bill had passed. When the solicitor in+ formed the said agent, that unless the petitioner could be compelled to do other- wise he would oppose the bill, the agent threatened that those who opposed the- company should be treated worse than those who agreed with them; as if the already possessed her property and she had been ousted—as if the company had' entered and taken possession of the very estate' and as if she was at the mercy or' the company. The petitioner, therefore, flung herself upon the protection of their Lordships. The other petition was from a gardener and nurseryman at Yeovil; , named John Hartnell, who made a somewhat similar statement to this noble lady., He had given .500L for one acre of land, had laid out his all upon it, and had no- other means of obtaining his livelihood; and now a railway was to go right- through his property. He was at their mercy: to be heard, he must have wit- nesses, and agents, and counsel, and a purse; and then he would have to contend against a company with half-a-million of money: therefore they would give him- something, or nothing, as they pleased.

In the beginning, it would have been difficult to foresee the nationals

aspect which the railway system would wear; but now it is the bounden. duty of Parliament to interfere. Besides the 130 or 140 railways already in existence, there are to be some 244 more; and with 200 or 300 ban' passing in one session, there must be imminent risk, without meaning it' but per ineuriam, of doing injury to individuals. By the law of England, not a Mot of a man's ground can be touched without his leave- but the: most excessive powers are given to railway companies. Theirs forms the•,- only case in the history of civilized nations in which a system of compul- sory sales has arisen, without the owner's being allowed even to refuse thi price offered. The Standing Orders are not effectual for checking the in.- advertent bestowal of such powers. In a recent case, a clause giving coy- , tain persons right of way to a railroad, over any man's property, without. paying for that right but only for the damage actually done, escaped the notice of the Standing Orders Committee. Another power given to these companies is to take materials without and against the consent of the- owners, not paying a price to be settled, but such as shall cover the das mage actually done. Is it to be said that the owner is not to have pretines-• afectionis? To aid in checking these abuses, Lord Brougham moved two, additional Standing Orders—

One related to a statement of the actual amount of consents given, and the

measurement of the distance through which they meant to carry the railway by compulsion, and where the consents were not obtained. Such information raw already be picked out of the documents, but this would show a concise view of s the dissents. The other order would produce information which the House had, not now: it was, that when a railway, passed not only over but near apersods, house, the company should tell them before the first reading what houses it passed within three hundred yards of. Lord Brougham then turned to the results of past speculation, as a warn., ing-

If in 1840, or in 1837 or 1838, still more if ten years prior to that period, any par',

ties had been told that they would not have made enormous fortunes by buying sl lanais they would have turned a deaf ear: they then talked not of 5, 6, or 7 per cent, buts never less than 15 or 20 per cent would be the result of every speculation in shares., What is the fact? By the returns before them, they had the average percentags. on the 32,000,0001. worth of shares at the original price; though, as manys had been bought at a premium, the amount invested, instead of being,. 32,000,0001., would in all probability be 42,000,000/. Now, the average profitA at present received for these 32.,000,0001., not of the lines dist have failed, but. of those that have succeeded—for he had left out some who did not pay any divi- dend at all—is 54 per cent. On 16,000,000/. of the 32,000,000/. the averagei profit is not 5 per cent—less than can be obtained by lending money to good brokers or by investments in small mortgages of 5001.; on 6,500,0001. the average1 profit is less than 3 psr cent—less than can be got by investment in the Three, per Cent Consolidated Bank Annuities; and on 2,000,000/. it is less than 2 per cent. On the stock of twelve railroads no dividend has been paid. Capital to; the amount of 42,000,0001. has been paid up. Of the 42,000,0001. paid there is, 25,500,000/. which would now sell for considerably less than at the time when the sums were paid; 9,000,0001. out of the 42,000,000/. would sell for one-half what was paid, and 2,000,000/. for one-quarter; so that the party would only get, 121. a year for his 1,0001., instead of 301 which he might have procured in this Three per Cent Consols.

The Earl of DALHOUSIE allowed that there was truth in Lord Broul.e. ham's complaints; but the picture was somewhat highly coloured. Mei did not oppose the motion. It was affirmed. Lord Baotionsas returned to the subject on Thursday. He presented si

petition from five creditors of turnpike-trusts in England, complaining or loss through the diminished value of their securities, in consequence of the' introduction of railways. The amount of credit upon turnpike-trusts it,: in England, 8,000,0001.; in Wales, 500,000L; in Scotland, 500,0001.; in all,., 9,000,0001. He stated the case of three sisters, who own a farm of two hundred acres in Essex, through which one railway already passes, and. eix other railways threaten to pass through it—two to each lady, and one to spare! He announced that he should introduce a third Standing Order, to give costs as against the railway projectors, at the discretion of the Com- mittee; so that poor persons may resist a railway-bill. The Marquis of CLasnuoastot agreed in these complaints; and hoped that in Ireland, which is as yet a carte blanche, mistakes of the kind will be avoided, by Government's pointing out the proper lines to be made. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE also concurred—

It seemed a good principle to make railway privileges terminable, and not to Make over in perpetuity all the arteries and veins in the country, never to be re- covered. That course prevailed in ahnost every Continental kingdom; and no difficulty had been experienced in France in procuring companies to take railways on lease for eighty, seventy, and even as low as forty-five years.

IMPROVEMENT or ENTAILED ESTATES. In the House of Lords, on Thurs- day, the Duke of RICHMOND moved for a Select Committee to inquire into the expediency of a legislative enactment to enable possessors of entailed estates to charge such estates with a sum, to be limited, for the purpose of draining and otherwise permanently improving the same. In Scotland, Moetgomerie's Act impowers the possessors of entailed estates to charge them with three-fourths of the sum so expended. In 1840, an act passed which gave facilities for the laying out of money in draining land; but that act has proved inefficient, probably be- cause the parties are compelled to go to the Court of Chancery; and that Court inspires them with so much dread that nothing would induce them to go there. The motion, supported by the Duke of CLEVELAND, Lord Astinunrorr, and Lord BEAUMONT, was affirmed, and the Committee was appointed; the Lord Chancellor at its head.

A NEW WRIT was ordered, on Monday, for the Western Division of Kent, in tles room of Viscount Mau-sham, succeeded to the Earldom of liming.